Clinton vs Trump, who would you vote for if it comes down to this?

[Dominate]

Please state reasons and also whether you've supported/voted democrats or republicans in the past.

[Aero]

Clinton easily. Trump is nice & entertaining but we need someone who's politically correct. All that name calling & ego is cute but not when it comes to real life decisions and war.

[Unfukwitable]

Don't trust neither, Clinton could've even keep her Husband happy, Trump comes off gimmicky to me. I can't even take this whole shit serious tbh.

[PancakeBrah]

Bernie Sanders.

I know a lot of Republicans. Most of my family, actually. A few Trump supporters in there. I lean left. If I was right leaning, though, I would be flipping my shit about Trump. It's a fiasco. He's an idiot, pandering to the dregs of the party and flipping the top. I know relatively 'intelligent' people who like how he 'isn't like other politicians'. It's fucking insane. He's taking the id of the motionless, or those who think they're motionless, and playing them for fools for his own brand. I, like most liberal people, thought he was a pipe dream. Like, 'could you imagine if they actually nominated him for the general?' There'd be a laugh. Between me and my internet friends. Then we'd go to our respective holes and jerk off to bondage films or whatever. That's neither here nor there.

If the Republicans really let Trump win the nom then not only will the democrats win, regardless of candidate, but the whole party will lose anything they've had.

In the one in a million shot he wins the presidency? Welcome to the end days, 'Murica.

@uh_oh go fuck yourself in advance.

[faggot Zelpher]

I wouldn't vote

[boof]

bernie sanders

hillary clinton sucks in so many political ways. trump sucks in so many decent human ways.

[El Muffin]

part of me wishes I could see what a trump presidency would be like

considering his business acumen/political approach.... orrrrr would all that go out the window n hed revert into puppet status?

sorta like how everyone thought Obama would shake things up but then he became just another president

[slech]

bernie sanders

[PancakeBrah]

yo all these fucking idiots agreeing with my bernie sanders thing makes me want to vote for rand paul. fuck you, idiot people

[Certain]

Donald Trump is a boar. Hillary Clinton is a bore.

[slech]

yo all these fucking idiots agreeing with my bernie sanders thing makes me want to vote for rand paul. fuck you, idiot people

relax your stacks

[Eŋg]

part of me wishes I could see what a trump presidency would be like

he wants to fuck his daughter.

[El Muffin]

Wait, w0t?

[Chill Phil]

bernie sanders

[Aero]

part of me wishes I could see what a trump presidency would be like

considering his business acumen/political approach.... orrrrr would all that go out the window n hed revert into puppet status?

sorta like how everyone thought Obama would shake things up but then he became just another president


Obama has been one of the better presidents. Top 10 easily.

[uh-oh]

I would vote for trump easily. Clinton is a horrendous candidate, her track record is abysmal and she should be in prison.

It pains me to say it but in a fair world bernie sanders would receive the nomination.

So then you have trump and bernie. I dont like trump. I just dislike him less then bernie. I dont think he is racist i just think hes a buffoon. The problem is bernie is a bigger buffoon. Trump is stupid when it comes to being politically correct in the sense he says inflammatory things. Bernie is stupid in the sense that he doesnt understand he cant get done 1/25 of what he wants.

Trump building a wall across the border is more realistic then bernie raising the federal minimum wage, making college free, making a single payer healthcare system etc.

They both are promising things that are unrealistic, so when you set those aside your left with a conservative businessman republican, and a super liberal career politician who is basically anti business.

Trump would get my vote but im not voting.

Rand would get my vote realistically even though he isnt close to what his pops is, but he'll be nowhere near winning anything.

Its a shit show. Love you cake

[Strikta]

Not voting.

[Geno]

Iono

[Dominate]

I'm under the impression that Clinton getting the Democrat nomination is pretty much a done deal?

Anyway, I asked specifically who would you vote for if it's her vs Trump. Not asking about Sanders or which candidate you like best of everyone. Add that detail if you wish but Answer my question plz.

[Witty]

I can't vote but it would definitely be Clinton, don't like her but she's the lesser of two evils.

Please don't elect Donald Trump, America.

[Dominate]

I'm under the impression that Clinton getting the Democrat nomination is pretty much a done deal?

Anyway, I asked specifically who would you vote for if it's her vs Trump. Not asking about Sanders or which candidate you like best of everyone. Add that detail if you wish but Answer my question plz.

[uh-oh]

Clinton is not the lesser of two evils.

She is an incompetent cunt.

[Certain]

Donald Trump is a truly garbage person. And yes, he wants to fuck his own daughter.

I don't find Trevor Noah that funny, but the quotes are all in here: http://www.cc.com/video-clips/73fxht/the-daily-show-with-trevor-noah-don-t-forget--donald-trump-wants-to-bang-his-daughter

[Witty]

Trevor Noah been one of my favourite comedians since I saw his African American standup show, he's better as a standup than on the daily show...though he's still finding his feet there.

[uh-oh]

Donald Trump is a truly garbage person. And yes, he wants to fuck his own daughter.

I don't find Trevor Noah that funny, but the quotes are all in here: http://www.cc.com/video-clips/73fxht/the-daily-show-with-trevor-noah-don-t-forget--donald-trump-wants-to-bang-his-daughter

word he's a weirdo

you never clarified who you prefer as president between him and hilary though.

[Certain]

I dislike Hilary Clinton. I have long disliked Hilary Clinton. I find her to be a fraud.

But yeah, I'd vote for her so quickly if she was facing Donald Trump or Ted Cruz. I don't mind Marco Rubio or Nikki Haley as much, but he has no shot to win and she already dropped out.

I've voted for Barack Obama both times and typically vote Democrat, though.

[uh-oh]

Why would you vote for hilary clinton tho wtf

I wish i could just blame my mysoginistic sexist views for preferring trump, but its more to do with hilary being shit at everything shes ever done.

I wouldve voted for obama both times. I preferred gore to bush. I dont identify with a party. If i did it would be republican probably. But they always have shit candidates.

This is the first time where they all seem like pure shit. Not a single one seems capable.

Maybe im just old enough to see through the bullshit promises and shit now tho and the fact the president really cant do shit

[Certain]

Donald Trump is a racist and misogynist. He doesn't even remotely try to hide it. His policy concepts, both international and domestic, are completely unrealistic. His supposed business acumen has included several bankruptcies in which he turned to the government to bail him out of bad decisions.

[timeless]

Hilary Clinton not being in prison literally makes me sick. To think she'll probably win is grounds for anarchy in the most crucial way.

[Strikta]

Next to what Cake said, Certain has the most intelligent post in the thread w/ Trump's assessment.

Trump would ruin us imo.

I find it a joke he's even a consideration for the Rep nomination.

Other nations are laughing at us, & they're not even doing it behind our back.

God bless America tho, right?

Right.

[El Muffin]

I really like what Nikki Haley is doing. She reeks of authenticity

Then again. I said that about Obama prior to his first term.

I'm becoming disillusioned w/ campaigns

Bout to actually delve into their records on issues ..but I'm guessing that doesn't matter much considering I'm not particularly left/right leaning. Like Chris Rock says "I got some shit I'm liberal about n some I'm conservative about" There is never a candidate I can throw my full support at. Sucks tbh

[El Muffin]

I'm under the impression that Clinton getting the Democrat nomination is pretty much a done deal?

Anyway, I asked specifically who would you vote for if it's her vs Trump. Not asking about Sanders or which candidate you like best of everyone. Add that detail if you wish but Answer my question plz.

Oh my bad.

Trump though. He's piqued my curiosity

N I don't think it's entirely fair to predict a presidency based on a campaign of this nature


For instance ..might be bad analogy but the president's of the extreme past used to be on some whole other shit when it came to integrity n inflammatory comments during campaigns.

Yet they turned out to be decent /serviceable

[Dominate]

Other nations are laughing at us, & they're not even doing it behind our back.



We were laughing heartily at first. Lolololol Trump as President! You're hilarious, America! ... Now it's more of a nervous chuckle bc we're not sure if America is actually joking any more.

[Strikta]

Sadly, it seems we are not. :(

I could delve more into this, but I like to keep my political views to myself, & for very good reason.. but Trump would get us hurt in many ways.

[Strikta]

We as people should have pushed away from this angle a long time ago. We get it tho, yeah it's America where anyone has a shot at the Presidency gig. Ok that was interesting & funny for a little bit.. but for some reason Trump still heavy in the polls to this day. We should have stopped entertaining this fucking joke months ago. Instead stupid blind Murica.

[Witty]

We were laughing heartily at first. Lolololol Trump as President! You're hilarious, America! ... Now it's more of a nervous chuckle bc we're not sure if America is actually joking any more.

This tbh.

Now we're just like...you know this is real life, right America?

This isn't a movie.

You are getting close to letting a cartoon character become the most powerful man in the world.

America doesn't know how often the rest of the world scratches it's head like 'oh ok, so you're really doing this'

[Dominate]

I like to keep my political views to myself, & for very good reason..

Can I know the reason? I mean... The amount of personal shit you have divulged to the Netcees community over the years... Lmao... But it's your political views that you want to keep private?

[Strikta]

My political views got me put in the hospital w/ a punctured lung when i was 24.

It's really not good ethics either imo.

I feel as tho a man(or bitch) should express very little on his views & stance, & just quietly vote.

[Useless]

I pray to god trump gets elected just so all the libtards have meltdowns.


I don't care who gets elected and I won't be voting, again. Usually it doesn't matter who gets elected because the same ppl run the country regardless of who's in office. But I think trump is already rich and just doesn't give a shit so he doesn't let those ppl push him around. That's why they want u to hate him so much. He does come off as a gimmick tho lol. Hard to imagine the dude that hosted celebrity apprentice could be president, who we gonna elect next, Ryan seacrest.


Hillary Clinton is a completely incompetent cunt who's only gotten where she is because of her name/husband. She should never be allowed to hold any type of office ever.


And it doesn't matter who u vote for, in the end ur vote doesn't mean shit.

[oats]

Trump is the first step to President Camacho from Idiocracy.

[uh-oh]

Trump is a G. I dont see him as racist. I do see him as mysoginistic. I don't see that as a bad thing. Fuck these hos. Fiorina is a hideous weirdo. Look at that face. Rosie odonnel is a mess. Look at her.

His daughter could catch dick.

Trump 2016 bros

[uh-oh]

I cant help but troll these threads honestly.

I get why trump is a buffoon but you all need to realize out of the 3 main people he is the lesser of all evils.

Im glad people can see clinton for the fraud she is, im just terrified that people prefer an outward fraud to someone who just says shit that you disageee with.

Witty what are your personal grievances with trump? I dont know how he is perceived internationally.

I think I read the UK is considering banning him? I remember him buying land over ther for a golf course and trying to displace a farmer or something because he messes up the view lol. Beyond that i dont know what hes done to have the uk hate him.

[Mike Wrecka]

Lmao @ all the minorities, half minorities, wiggers and hipsters in this thread scared af of Trump winning


It's happening. White people taking back the country and making it glorious again. Deal with it libtards

[Strikta]

^Fuck u.

[Certain]

When did white people lose control? You think a black president changed that? Do you watch the news?

I did enjoy that immediately after uh-oh said he doesn't think Donald Trump is racist, Mike Wrecka posted that.

Here's the evidence if you really need it: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/donald-trump-is-a-bigot-and-a-racist/2015/12/01/a2a47b96-9872-11e5-8917-653b65c809eb_story.html

And why wouldn't the rest of the world hate him if he openly hates them? His immigration policies and ideas on global diplomacy would cause World War III within his first term. Luckily, far too many of the 60 percent of Republicans who don't support him will vote Democrat in the general election. His chance of becoming president is small.

[uh-oh]

Yea see i disagree with all of that. I was hoping to be swayed but you posted an opinion piece with nothing to do with race lol. Muslim isnt a race. Its a religion. I dont see whats wrong with deporting ILLEGAL immigrants. How is that being racist? The obama stuff is silly for sure but again its not like he called him a "nigger" he was a goof like the rest of conservative republicans who would say anything to demean the "socialist" obama.

I was hoping for actual quotes.

Also if you think republicans will vote for hilary or sanders instead of trump you are as big of a fool as i am for not seeing him as a racist.

Republicans and most of even middle america democrats have had enough of the dems with obama. At best youll have a continuation of obamas nonsense with hilary and at worse you have an even more radical in bernie

Trump wins that.

Thats why these polls make no sense to me. Who is being polled?

[Diode]

Lmao @ all the minorities, half minorities, wiggers and hipsters in this thread scared af of Trump winning


It's happening. White people taking back the country and making it glorious again. Deal with it libtards

keep it up. i'm in a banning mood.

[Certain]

So being ardently anti-Muslim (a religion dominated by brown and black people) is OK and definitely not racist or anything? By the way, you have yet to produce any bit of evidence that Hillary Clinton is worse. She is not a continuation of President Obama. They disagree on so many things, as you probably don't remember from the 2008 primaries. Her policies actually tend to be more moderate, but she simply isn't a likable person.

I will say that I think 10 percent of Republicans would not vote for Donald Trump against Clinton. That would account for only moderates and minorities. George W. Bush had support among Latinos that Mr. Make Mexico Build A Wall won't. With that said, the country is divided so much that losing 10 percent of your party gives you little chance — even if those voters either sit the election out or vote for a third-party candidate.

The ideal scenario is that the GOP overrules its own voters and picks Ted Cruz over Trump because of party politics. One of the reasons Trump has gained support is because he definitely does not fall in line with the standard Republican points of view. Polls show close to 70 percent of Trump's supporters would vote for him as a third-party or independent candidate.

I don't think Trump can win either way, but I know he can't win if he splits the Republican vote.

[uh-oh]

Agreed, the problem is republicans wont vote for hilary over him.

I didnt know i needed to produce why clinton is worse, because i dont view it as opinion as much as fact. Simply google the benghazi hearings. Look at how she had a private server for her emails and had classified government documents in them. Her track record in obamas cabinet. Trump wants to keep muslims out until they can be screened and a process created to reduce the likelihood they have radical ties. Meanwhile hilary has been apart of the brutal droning campaigns murdering countless innocents. She claims trump is used as a recruiting tool when the biggest cause of new recruits is the droning campaigns from syria to pakistan to afghanist iraq fucking yemen.

She is proven trash. The only problem is trump has no experience politically so he could be infinitely worse. He doesnt have a track record to pick apart.

Its like america is the cleveland browns. Havent been great since the 50s and 60s. Sortve turned it around in the 80s 90s but not really. And been abysmal since. Now they have to debate whether they find a journeymen bum backup or use there first rounder on jared goff.

Do you want someone proven incapable or someone that shows promise but done nothing.

Probably a bad analogy. Lol.

Its just you can pick at trumps "personal" public life which has been strategically designed to be in headlines by saying shit, but with hilary you can pick apart the actual political work she has done.

[Diode]

for a conspiracy theorist you sure have a bad case of media-induced confirmation bias.

that's all i'll add here because arguing with you is like arguing with y'all queda.

[Certain]

It's always fun when the end of "America being great" directly coincides with the Civil Rights movement. But keep on fucking that chicken.

[Fracture]

Shut the fuck up.

You remind me of this faggot I work with who is pompous and says shit that sucks

Plus he thinks he can win fights using only his legs. That's you. I literally enjoy reading your shit like people who question their actions like watching Cops

[Objective]

I can't vote but it would definitely be Clinton, don't like her but she's the lesser of two evils.

Please don't elect Donald Trump, America.

In Norway and lots of other places the fact that it's actually a possibility Trump will get serious amounts of votes is ridiculous and this notion comes from both left and right wing enthusiasts. I don't get how people can take him seriously and that he's this high up the chain of politics and in the limelight as much as he is. Like what the actual fuck...

[Fracture]

Fuck trump and what is a Norway

[uh-oh]

certain i was more referencing kennedy being killed then civil rights stuff. but hey bernie sanders marched amiright lets get him in and make everything free

ya boob

and diode <3

[Mike Wrecka]

We've had eight years of a pos Muslim loving president. One that takes better care of illegal immigrants than he does our own veterans.


Trump will set that straight. I'm sure a lot of u weirdos are isolated in parts of the country where illegals and Muslims aren't a problem. Good for you. I'm not. They are a huge problem that needs to be addressed. It will eventually reach you.

[El Muffin]

Mike in here talm bout minorities n "half" minorities n he a watered down dago wop

Hshahahaha Mike is hilarious

[~RustyGunZ~]

I'm a Rand supporter and will be voting for Gary Johnson if it's Trump vs Clinton

[Fart]

Vote John Cena

[Witty]

We've had eight years of a pos Muslim loving president. One that takes better care of illegal immigrants than he does our own veterans.


Trump will set that straight. I'm sure a lot of u weirdos are isolated in parts of the country where illegals and Muslims aren't a problem. Good for you. I'm not. They are a huge problem that needs to be addressed. It will eventually reach you.

Lmao

[oats]

lol@Sanders being radical, when his policies are easily the most populist out there.

[Certain]

Populism is radical these days.

[oats]

it's funny you say that. I've gone back and watched the presidential debates going back to Clinton-Dole, with some VP debates as well. It's amazing how much republican politics have shifted to the right compared to how democrats have gone left. obv I'm biased, but there is demonstrable evidence that conservatism has become more conservative while mainstream liberalism (not college campus liberalism) has remained very similar for two decades. makes me glad I'm in Korea sometimes.

[uh-oh]

When i said sanders is even more radical im referencing the fact he wants to make all these giant sweeping changes which isnt what any republicans want. He is pushing much more change than hilary which makes him worse in the eyes of conservative republican america

So if he got the nomination no republican will vote for him over trump. Thats what i was referencing.

[Certain]

I agree; no Republican would vote for Bernie Sanders over any candidate. I do think that if those two were the options, many people on both sides would sit this one out entirely, or a third party would gain late support (but not enough).

I actually agree with most of the tenets Sanders espouses. I just don't think he has a fucking clue about how to accomplish them. If elected, he would be the next Jimmy Carter, who even alienated those who supported him.

[oats]

I agree that conservatives will find a hard time voting for Sanders if he's the option, especially since he's an unapologetic SOCIALIST (oh no!). But at the same time, he's done well attracting conservative crowds in red states, as well as engaging in civil dialogue with those who don't traditionally agree with him (see his speech at that Bible college, for reference).

Here's why I will vote for Bernie. I don't agree with him on every point (I don't think such a candidate exists, or should exist, really). And even on the things I agree with, I doubt he will get much accomplished. That's fine. But his campaign is run on what I believe to be the linchpin for fixing our political system, and that is reforming campaign financing. If he can do that, and nothing else, then he will have been a success in my eyes.

The reason Trump holds sway, other than tapping the id of our social consciousness and exploiting genuine frustrations with current politics, is that he's "too rich to be bought." Which is silly to me. First, even if the president isn't bought, the rest of congress is, so it won't matter. More than that, though, how about we fix the system instead of hoping that we get politicians who are noble enough (or rich enough) to avoid corruption?

[Certain]

quaker oats, we don't let Koreans vote.

This is America.

[oats]

BERNIE CAN FIX THAT #Koreans2016

[Diode]

Consequently, the idea of fixing the broken, lobbyist, bought and sold, term limitless Congress is exactly what Obama floated in his final SOTU.

That tends to happen in a lame duck year when no fucks are left to give.

Sadly, nothing will change.

Fuck Citizens United.
Fuck the repeal of Glass Steagal

AND ESPECIALLY FUCK RONNIE RAYGUN KEYNESIAN TRICKLE DOWN FUCKING NONSENSE

THE GAP CONTINUES TO GROW AT A RATE UNSEEN SINCE PRE-TEDDY TRUSTBUSTING

Cable News is the new Yellow Journalism

[El Muffin]

Yeah!

[oats]

Reagan was far from Keyensian lol, but other than that agreed Diode. I'm no Keyensian apologist, though. A few years ago I was, but the more I study econ, the more I think that life is too messy to singularly theorize. I'm all about that SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT ECON these days.

[Diode]

Who propagated TRICKLE DOWN after Nixon, oats?

Some dumbshit actor from California.

[oats]

oh I agree, but that's not Keyensian at all. Quite the opposite. For reference, Paul Krugman is a staunch advocate of Keynes. Reaganomics is more aligned with Keynes' ideological foil FA Hayek.

[Objective]

I'm sure a lot of u weirdos are isolated in parts of the country where illegals and Muslims aren't a problem. Good for you. I'm not. They are a huge problem that needs to be addressed. It will eventually reach you.

Every day I go to work I leave the bus in Oslo where occasionally a bunch of Syrians just entered the country. My ex live at a place on the east side pf Oslo where you had to go through a place called ''Grønland'' which is nicknamed ''little Pakistan'' due to the amount of Muslims and immigrants that live there. Nor her or me NEVER encountered anything bad there even though the reputation is as bad as it gets.

A childhood friend of mine got brutally raped and almost killed after some Somali dude decided he wanted some pussy, that definitely left an impact on me as well on how cruel some immigrants can be. But I do I hate them all beside of that one shithead that did it? No. My ex's coworker experienced a friend of hers being gunned down in a restaurant and killed in Sweden, Gothenburg where immigration is a serious issue. I have also been chased by a bunch of Somalians after they talked shit to me and a few others, when we approached the 4 of them (it'd be 4 vs 4), we talked some shit and got ready only to see that they yelled something I couldn't understand and a storm of 8-10 other Somalian guys came running around the corner of a house. If we hadn't made a run for it, who the fuck knows what'd happen. Never found them when we managed to get at a safe place and called everyone we knew either for retaliation. When I looked we did stumble upon a couple Somalians that was scared out of their pants and didn't know what we talked about, either way they seemed to only be waiting for the bus. Did we beat them up? No, we kept looking for those who actually mattered. I grew up in an area where ''Muslims'' and other kids would pull a knife on you if they felt like it, that happened to me too but ironically it was a Norwegian cop's shithead son that did it. Assholes will be assholes regardless of race. None of us, not even my ex's coworker blames it on ALL Muslims.
I never hung around the bad apples too much when I grew up but I did have Muslim friends that wouldn't even hurt a fly and talked between themselves how much they hated the people doing that shit because they were negatively affected by it as well by misdirected hate like the shit in your reply. And it was about 10-20 known really bad apples in the neighborhood, the rest was amazing people that'd help you with absolutely everything if you asked unless it was illegal and/or fight/alcohol related, because that would be against the Q'ran and they truly believed in the ''love thy neighbor'' approach.

I also grew up with a mother working at an asylum center with people coming from all kinds of places. Balkan (don't ask me why they thought it was smart to put Serbians and Albanians in the same place though, caused some ruckus/yelling at each other at first but they just kept for themselves afterwards), Afghanistan, Pakistan, Turkey, Iran, Afghanistan etc. There were maybe 2-3 actual bad apples there and that was enough for the community around to alienate the 200 people that lived there even though the residents didn't even want to talk to the people causing shit in the area, or even look in their direction. You remind me about the surrounding ''including'' community.
These are people that have been through civil wars, seen their relatives and siblings killed in front of them, been through wars caused and funded by the US, Norway and other countries and got real stories so bad you'd silently wish for them to stop telling what they've been through cuz it's so bad when they felt like sharing something from their lives. People that was so mentally fucked up I once saw a guy running in circles slamming his head during Christmas times because someone decided they wanted to fire up fireworks in the area and thought everything was happening all over again. In Norway you can only fire up fireworks during New Years eve due to dogs, elderly people, immigrants and so on being negatively effected by random fireworks like that. And I understand that completely.

The amount of idiots is such a small amount you'd have to be a cold ass dude with no insight into the difficulties other people face if you decide it's better to just lock the door for everyone and leave them outside because you think it's better that way.
I've seen the shit you speak of and experienced it first hand, and got friends that have been through shit immigrants have done. But those immigrants are really far and few between, a lot more than what the media portrays and all the majority really want is a second chance of having a normal life because everything they lived for and knew is blown to shit. But yeah, I'll make sure to make a ''No Mike Wrecka''-sign at the border if the entire US goes to shit and you seek a second chance here in Norway for things you can't control.

Regarding money Norway has earned 15.3 billion Norwegian Kroner in taxes from immigrants that have gotten here over the past 20 years, 19.7 billion in total taxes. Don't know if these numbers are 100% correct but I do believe it was 15.3 and 19.7 respectively, the remaining 3.4 billion Norwegian Kroner is what was used on integration, language courses and helping them to get a job along with other social services.

The anti-Muslim shit you spew is toxic to humanity as a whole, just as toxic as the idea of implementing Sharia laws instead of fighting against them which most Muslims I've talked to don't mind not being incorporated because they too think it's detrimental to society as a whole. Your view on Muslims seems to stem from an Oz-atmosphere where you think all of them is Kareem Said sympathizers and would do the same as he does if an opportunity arises to do so.

The real danger isn't Muslims, the real danger is right wing nuts. Think Anders Behring Breivik, that's where the danger lies. And if you don't want Muslims to attack your country perhaps alienating them and hating on them might not be the best course of action. Be an example, give them room and befriend some. Show them the values you want them to learn to the rest, because that shit sticks and helps a lot more than showing the middle finger.

Trump is a fucking joke to the rest of the world, and you're the punchline. It's funny you don't see it yourself.

[oats]

yo Mike Wrecka, aren't a SPED teacher?

[NYCSPITZ]

Is SPIRO AGNEW on dis ticket? I'd vote 4 that wigga...

[Diode]

Objective for President

[El Muffin]

Black hawk down 2

Starring, objective

Interesting read

BTW we are aware that trump is a joke n we are the punchline

Trouble is we don't give a fuck

Murica

[uh-oh]

Let norway take the syrians since objective loves them so much. Here in MURICA we look down on savages that fondle and molest women because they went outside dressed like whores. Have the common decency to do it in your imagination like the rest of us.

There is nothing wrong with creating a thorough screening process to ensure the people you let in dont make a bomb and blow up a crowd of AMERICANS

Trump never said keep them out for good. Just to keep them out until they can figure out a process that makes sense.

He must be the devil right

[Objective]

Let norway take the Jews since objective loves them so much. Here in MURICA we look down on Jews that fondle and molest women because they went outside dressed like whores. Have the common decency to do it in your imagination like the rest of us.

There is nothing wrong with creating a Berlin Wall v.2.0 to ensure the people you let in dont make a bomb and blow up a crowd of AMERICANS

Trump never said keep Jews out for good. Just to keep Jews out until Hitler can figure out a process that makes sense.

He must be the devil right

Switched out a couple words for you...

Nah, but seriously. If that was the only issue Trump was facing we could have a healthy debate, unfortunately it's not. He acts like a 5 year old child with a hissy fit 50% of the time and got sickening views on women. He tries to shield it but it's come out time and time again.

He literally looks down on ALL Muslims by denying them access (how could family/friends visit each other that never did anything wrong if that were put into effect??? How does this seem right to you?) and creates a certain notion/fear in people that Muslims must be avoided because they're potential harm making an already serious issue worse. Unprecedented hate and crimes based on the preconceived notion all Muslims are bad news will only raise as a result to this. (Not saying this is what he says but it'll definitely be the way a shitload of Americans will take it...) Do you think that's fair? There's Muslims from all kinds of places all over the globe, should they be refused entrance to the US even though they've lived their whole lives in European countries without having a criminal record? That's racial profiling in a way that shouldn't be accepted, and claiming Mexicans sends over rapists and shitload of people that commits crimes and want THEM to pay for the wall is outrageous as well. He claims he got nothing against Mexicans but he don't seem very friendly towards them either.

People are running from actual war zones, they got no where to go. They're political refugees and during times of war it's a countries duty to help out when they enter. Why Saudi Arabia ain't getting enough shit for not helping out but we still shake hands with them is where the real issue should be faced as well. We all got a responsibility here. And who helped create the war in the first place? Norway and the US is definitely to blame for parts of it, the least we could do is help the innocent people that's actual in pain as a direct result of this. It's like bullying a person and demand the bullied person to switch schools if he can't handle the abuse instead of dealing with the issue at the source.

To take such an action you seem to love so much is against the Geneva Convention that the UN put together, it's put together for a reason as well. If you think it's no problem so say fuck all to that it wouldn't surprise me, Norway did not decide not to extricate a prisoner to the US because it didn't live up to the basic human conditions a prison should have by default in a developed country. That's some serious shit.

Look, the actions Trump want to take will completely ruin several ties the US has. Important ties that will inevitably only cause more distance between the US and other countries that may or not support you, neutral countries will probably take a step back too. I hope you consider the consequences of what that man can do. I know I'm liberal, a left wing person at that but the US really needs a more wide political party on the republican side as well, probably the left too when I think about it. There's literally no moderate people slightly leaning to the left or the right on that and if you're a republican you're kind of doomed as well if you're not really for the left side but not really for the right side either so you go with what you assume to be the lesser evil. That's another serious issue imho.

I don't give a fuck what you vote, one of my better friends is on the right side as well... A Pakistanian kid that grew up in a Muslim household. But the shit that Trump advocates is laughable even to him. A friend of mine votes for the far right and even he shakes his head.

Donal Trump is living satire and it's seriously dangerous to see how he plan on doing things. If things was bad before it'll definitely get worse under his reign. Say goodbye to a lot of important relations that could prove to be useful and create more reasons for the Muslim part of the world to hate you even more.

And yeah, if people are groping other and/or doing shit I wouldn't mind sending them right back. I do agree that certain measures need to be made in order to create a safer environment for everyone but a solution like that is definitely not the way to go about it. And you saying ''AMERICANS'' instead of looking upon this as a global issue developed countries should go together and help fix is another problem. We should come together and help each other out. Cooperation is key.

[Strikta]

This fucking thread here.

[Split Eight]

Republicans are a joke.

The whole liberals vs. conservatives conflict is also the worst. Liberal= unrealistic ideas about the country's future. Conservative= unrealistic ideas about the country's past. But hearing conservatives talk about current events is 10,000x worse. The general stance is ignore/ prosecute everyone who isn't a straight white middle class Christian and eventually all your problems will go away.

Also, Conservatives' anti-euthanasia, anti-abortion, anti-welfare, anti-civil rights, pro-death sentence, pro- gun stances are beyond baffling.

I was told that maybe living in MA has something to do with it, where the only outspoken Republican/ Conservatives are pretty much the boldest of the bold. Like, moving somewhere not so heavily liberal would show the crazies on both sides of the fence.

Anyways, I would *not* vote for anyone trying to repeal Obamacare and I would definitely not vote for a xenophobe.

Clinton

[Sharp]

Clinton

In a nutshell

I live in/work in/around the melting pot of Philadelphia and I won't use any acquaintances or students as examples out of respect to them but we have lots of cultures and colors here, ranging from dark brown to cream... And the thing I see is anecdotal evidence of someone being an asshole or a piece of human debris starts to represent an entire race

Lot of conservative people here who turn xenophobia into Trump support. Plenty more who actually want to elect Rubio or Kasich (even though he tapered off)

The Trump supporters I do know tend to view the race more like entertainment though...I'm praying for the wakeup call.

But yeah. Sanders would be cool but he's not conservative enough to fly in America. Clinton is electable and doesn't really have a bad record... Benghazi is a joke and the email server makes me trust her less but she's a career politician. It feels like that comes with the territory now. But actual policy stuff has Clinton looking decent


Infinite rep to objective though

[NYCSPITZ]

V/ I'm moving to brazil

[Destroyer]

all this thread did for me was to further cement the fact that Mike wrecka is the dumbest fucking idiot to ever post here

[uh-oh]

Clinton is electable and doesn't really have a bad record... Benghazi is a joke and the email server makes me trust her less but she's a career politician.

Do you know anything about hilary clinton? Please educate yourself. Benghazi isnt a joke. The email shit is serious but thats just recently.

Shes been mired in shit since she was first lady

[anime_boners]

Lmao @ all the minorities, half minorities, wiggers and hipsters in this thread scared af of Trump winning


It's happening. White people taking back the country and making it glorious again. Deal with it libtards

So, whites will "take back" America (they already own it/the rest of the world tho??) and make it a shittier place for non-whites to live.. thus making it glorious?

a country that was literally founded to be a land of equal opportunities for ALL people. will be better. when we make it a "white man's land" again?

let me ask you a serious question?

how did you get here? how did you become a fan of hip hop and this culture? if you have a problem with minorities, half minorities (which is not a fucking thing, because if you are mixed you are a person of color and you bear that burden regardless) wiggers (also not a real thing, but a racist concept) and "hipsters"(also not really a thing), what is left in hip hop that attracted you in the first place?

[NYCSPITZ]

yo I like mike wrecka but he's from long island I think they have a disease there called I consume too much mainstream media

[Objective]

Also Mike Wrecka, I was thinking of leaving this out but one of my Norwegian young adolescent friends turned completely nuts and joined IS after some friends ratted him out. He stored stolen goods from entering homes and stealing shit when people wasn't home or asleep at his own apartment, when caught his ''friends'' ratted him out to get a more lenient sentence themselves, and he got extremely radicalized in jail cuz he finally felt people understood him and that he had a family of his own that cared. He was brought up in foster care so it probably wasn't hard to make him feel at home in that crowd.
He also ended up on a top 5 wanted list in Norway and has been involved with car chases and shootings which was not something he would even think about doing before entering jail.

It definitely hit me emotionally when we learned that he had fled the country to join IS and would most likely never return or be killed down there, so yeah... I think it's safe to say I know pretty well the dangers of it all.

[Dominate]

Liberal= unrealistic ideas about the country's future. Conservative= unrealistic ideas about the country's past.


Nice.

[Mike Wrecka]

all this thread did for me was to further cement the fact that Mike wrecka is the dumbest fucking idiot to ever post here

Ur a 40 year old pot head that makes 25 grand a year. I'm pretty sure ur opinion on anything is irrelevant to me

So, whites will "take back" America (they already own it/the rest of the world tho??) and make it a shittier place for non-whites to live.. thus making it glorious?

a country that was literally founded to be a land of equal opportunities for ALL people. will be better. when we make it a "white man's land" again?

let me ask you a serious question?

how did you get here? how did you become a fan of hip hop and this culture? if you have a problem with minorities, half minorities (which is not a fucking thing, because if you are mixed you are a person of color and you bear that burden regardless) wiggers (also not a real thing, but a racist concept) and "hipsters"(also not really a thing), what is left in hip hop that attracted you in the first place?

I never said I was racist. Or disliked minorities. I just said it's funny how scared they are at the thought of trump winning. And they shouldn't be. He is only against illegal immigrants. If a nation doesn't have any borders it's no longer a nation. Let me ask you a serious question. Do you think it's right that people come here illegally and take jobs from Americans like me and you.? While not paying taxes. And then they take all the money they earn and send it back to their country. While Obama gives them free health care. If u think that's ok ur a fool.

Also Mike Wrecka, I was thinking of leaving this out but one of my Norwegian young adolescent friends turned completely nuts and joined IS after some friends ratted him out. He stored stolen goods from entering homes and stealing shit when people wasn't home or asleep at his own apartment, when caught his ''friends'' ratted him out to get a more lenient sentence themselves, and he got extremely radicalized in jail cuz he finally felt people understood him and that he had a family of his own that cared. He was brought up in foster care so it probably wasn't hard to make him feel at home in that crowd.
He also ended up on a top 5 wanted list in Norway and has been involved with car chases and shootings which was not something he would even think about doing before entering jail.

It definitely hit me emotionally when we learned that he had fled the country to join IS and would most likely never return or be killed down there, so yeah... I think it's safe to say I know pretty well the dangers of it all.


Just because u type a lot doesn't make you right. Ur Norwegian. U live in Norway. Don't try to pretend to relate to Americans. It's sad and pathetic. Here's what I know about Norway. It's sort of cold there. That's it. I don't care to know or pretend to know more. Because ur irrelevant. Is your country being invaded on a daily basis by a third world country neighbor? I doubt it

[Diode]

At first I thought this was a lame troll attempt, but no, you are legitimately a Tea Party lunatic.

Get your ass up to Oregon and play cops and robbers with the Feds. It will totally end well for you.

[Witty]

Lmao

[anime_boners]

I never said I was racist. Or disliked minorities. I just said it's funny how scared they are at the thought of trump winning. And they shouldn't be. He is only against illegal immigrants.

you do know he wants to deport naturally born US citizens whose parents weren't citizens?

you also realize he said racism is over? you realize he actually asked was the black lives matter movement supposed to mean they matter more than white people? to which he then added "go back to africa and see how much they mean there"

you realize when his supporters beat up a black protester he supported their behavior? saying "maybe he should have been roughed up"

I won't even touch what he has said about muslims. many of whom live here legally. majority of whom want nothing to do with terror organizations.


yet you will vote for him and say he's not a racist and neither are you.

cool. that's cool. do your thing.

[Certain]

"If I'm racist, why would I listen to Wu-Tang Clan?"

[Objective]

Since I'm the typical stereotype the world think of us and live it to its full extent I refuse to listen to anyones opinions, and I will continue to do so because I'm ignorant. I'm the only one that's right, fuck all other nations because 'MURICA. Also, Muslims kinda suck, imirite guys?!

I hear you loud and clear Mike Wrecka, thank God the stereotype only applies to a certain type of shitheads. I'm not really one to advocate suicides but you make it difficult to say the least.

[Sharp]

Do you know anything about hilary clinton? Please educate yourself. Benghazi isnt a joke. The email shit is serious but thats just recently.

Shes been mired in shit since she was first lady

Yes I do, I already have, and yes it is. Hillary was a bitter pill to swallow for any vaguely liberal person but, especially compared to Trump, doing some research helps. The Benghazi Committee is largely known to just be the anti-Hillary machine (most infamously confirmed by Kevin Walker aka the man who almost succeeded John Boehner as speaker of the house)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/kevin-mccarthy-benghazi-committee_us_560bdeb5e4b0dd850309e5ed

and validated by Rep. Richard Hanna (Republican from NY)

https://soundcloud.com/bill-keeler/10-14-15-seg-9


The hearing was a joke. Virtually all 'questioning' was based on berating Hillary. I watched it and saw republicans offer nothing new with virtually no facts and Clinton offering politically savvy non-answers (admittedly to non-questions). The only person who made any sense at that hearing was Elijah Cummings who just seemed pissed to be there

Here's your Benghazi timeline (I've read most, skimmed all)

http://www.factcheck.org/2012/10/benghazi-timeline/

and at this point I'm not taking anything more from you without a credible source and I realize that Hillary and maybe Boehner are the only names in this post that mean anything to you

Just please don't call my own personal research into question when this post has more sources than your 2015

also lemme know if you need any filthy liberal basslines for future tracks

[oats]

I'm not a fan of Clinton by any means, but if you would rather have Trump as president, it's pretty safe to say you're an idiot. And I'm speaking purely on his proposed "policies." That he's a horrendous human being is oblique to the fact that he simply has no clue how shit works on a global stage.

Mike Wrecka being a rootin tootin Tea Partier is odd to me if he is in fact a SPED teacher. Typically, that profession breeds a little more empathy and compassion than hardcore conservatism engenders. Not to mention, they're usually the first to put education funding on the chopping block.

[uh-oh]

Yes I do, I already have, and yes it is. Hillary was a bitter pill to swallow for any vaguely liberal person but, especially compared to Trump, doing some research helps. The Benghazi Committee is largely known to just be the anti-Hillary machine (most infamously confirmed by Kevin Walker aka the man who almost succeeded John Boehner as speaker of the house)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/kevin-mccarthy-benghazi-committee_us_560bdeb5e4b0dd850309e5ed

and validated by Rep. Richard Hanna (Republican from NY)

https://soundcloud.com/bill-keeler/10-14-15-seg-9


The hearing was a joke. Virtually all 'questioning' was based on berating Hillary. I watched it and saw republicans offer nothing new with virtually no facts and Clinton offering politically savvy non-answers (admittedly to non-questions). The only person who made any sense at that hearing was Elijah Cummings who just seemed pissed to be there

Here's your Benghazi timeline (I've read most, skimmed all)

http://www.factcheck.org/2012/10/benghazi-timeline/

and at this point I'm not taking anything more from you without a credible source and I realize that Hillary and maybe Boehner are the only names in this post that mean anything to you

Just please don't call my own personal research into question when this post has more sources than your 2015

also lemme know if you need any filthy liberal basslines for future tracks

I dont know how to link on my phone.

Did they not ask for more security?

[Certain]

I was told that maybe living in MA has something to do with it, where the only outspoken Republican/ Conservatives are pretty much the boldest of the bold. Like, moving somewhere not so heavily liberal would show the crazies on both sides of the fence.

I've lived everywhere, politically speaking. The big difference is the really radically liberal side has no real power. It took a pretty bad frontrunner for someone like Bernie Sanders to get any national fame, and he still has almost no shot to win the candidacy.

The Republican frontrunners are Donald Trump and Ted Cruz.

[Sharp]

I dont know how to link on my phone.

Did they not ask for more security?

You copy the url? I'm on my phone

And yes it's well known that hundreds of requests for extra security never got to her

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/10/benghazi-hearing-whats-new/


Clearly they should've gotten more but those requests never got to her. Someone should be held accountable. Hard to blame that on Hilary

[uh-oh]

You copy the url? I'm on my phone

And yes it's well known that hundreds of requests for extra security never got to her

http://www.factcheck.org/2015/10/benghazi-hearing-whats-new/


Clearly they should've gotten more but those requests never got to her. Someone should be held accountable. Hard to blame that on Hilary
Its really not though, it was her responsibility.

Unless it wasnt. I was hust under the assumption it was since shes been raked over the coals for it.

Benghazi isnt the only thing tho, its just one scand in a string of them that have been her entire political career. Im pretty sure she was the first, first lady ever tried for anything way back in the early 90s

Id have to look into it more tho, im just going off some 8 year old nonsense i learned when i was in full conspiracy mode back in the day.

I just dont view these things as nothing like she makes them out to be. She shrugs and acts like having a private server with classified shit on it isnt a big deal, meanwhile they dishonor petrayus or however you spell it for the same shit.

Shes scum. Trump is only better because he hasnt had the chance to do any illeg shifty political shit because hes not a politician. Also i am a mysoginist lol. I gotta look into what anime boners is talking about though this is the first im hearing about him telling blacks to go back to africa or whatever lol

And him saying the guys hould be roughed up was trumps usual brash way of speaking. He didnt mean it BECAUSE the guy was black, but because the guy was trying to fuck up his shit

But again i havent been studying trumps every move. I just see him say funny dumb shit and giggle.

I have no horse in this race. Like everyone with a brain im in the middle. Left right liberal conservative is all nonsense.

I just lean more conservative cuz im a white male who hates change. Obama got me an extra 300 or so in fines for obamacare. Lets get a shitball republican in there to repeal that so i can go back to being a burden on hospitals with the only thing being punished being my made up credit score

[oats]

It took a pretty bad frontrunner for someone like Bernie Sanders to get any national fame


what makes you say that?

[Diode]

what makes you say that?

America's left is center, if not right and even far right in most other countries. To have an outright socialist lead any kind of poll is a monumental occurrence.

[oats]

America's left is center, if not right and even far right in most other countries. To have an outright socialist lead any kind of poll is a monumental occurrence.

I understand that, but he's running on a nearly identical platform as Obama in 08 and Gore in 2000 on the Big Issues. He's more outspoken about his nominal affiliation, which I know makes people nervous, but his actual stances aren't terribly radical. Overly idealistic? Sure. But not radical.

[Diode]

I understand that, but he's running on a nearly identical platform as Obama in 08 and Gore in 2000 on the Big Issues. He's more outspoken about his nominal affiliation, which I know makes people nervous, but his actual stances aren't terribly radical. Overly idealistic? Sure. But not radical.

His outspokenness is absolutely radical.

[Certain]

I understand that, but he's running on a nearly identical platform as Obama in 08 and Gore in 2000 on the Big Issues. He's more outspoken about his nominal affiliation, which I know makes people nervous, but his actual stances aren't terribly radical. Overly idealistic? Sure. But not radical.

Not only what Diode said, but also, his policy concepts are significantly more extreme. There's a large gap between "Berniecare" and "Obamacare" in pragmatic terms.

[oats]

Fair enough. I just find it strange analysis to say that his success is due to a weak frontrunner.

[oats]

Not only what Diode said, but also, his policy concepts are significantly more extreme. There's a large gap between "Berniecare" and "Obamacare" in pragmatic terms.

In some areas I can see that, but in terms of foreign policy, economics, climate change, he's not at all extreme, even in the context of modern American politics. I think this type of stuff is overstated because he is an outspoken socialist.

[Objective]

I don't follow US politics that closely but what I've heard so far I'd probably vote for Bernie Sanders. Any solid reasons to why I shouldn't if I was an American citizen? In short, what's Berniecare and what are his most extreme views that opposing party members doesn't like or don't think will work in practice?

[NYCSPITZ]

school and healthcare should be free tho...like a human right and shit, naw mean...

[oats]

I don't follow US politics that closely but what I've heard so far I'd probably vote for Bernie Sanders. Any solid reasons to why I shouldn't if I was an American citizen? In short, what's Berniecare and what are his most extreme views that opposing party members doesn't like or don't think will work in practice?

what I believe gets the most eyeballs rolling is: raising minimum wage, federally funded public universities, and a single-payer healthcare system. Though I'm a supporter of Bernie, I do agree that those proposals are unfeasible to varying degrees.

Edit: Though I should mention, how he plans to pay for them - largely through raising or adding taxes and military spending cuts - is also a source of contention for a lot of folks.

[Objective]

quaker oats: Aaah, I see. I'm more certain I'd vote for Bernie Sanders then. But only because I know it works in practice over here. Free healthcare, free universities and minimum wage is higher. I don't mind adding to the pool as I'll probably need it some day as well. A friend of mine wouldn't be able to get extremely important drugs on prescriptions if it wasn't for free healthcare as the pills would have been too expensive that way, but regardless what party you vote for I don't think the free health care system would even be a debate as everyone kind of agrees it's a good thing. It's more an issue whether or not there should be more privatized hospitals or not.

How much do you pay in taxes now? The average here is 25-30% or so I think, it can be lower/higher depending on how much you earn and whether or not you got any loans that needs down payment, if you got something like that you can display your financial situation and get reduced taxes so you get a little push to make it through during harsh times but you'll still earn less (in most cases) than you would if you didn't have any loans. And it's 47.5% at most for the rich folks. I think it's pretty fair the way it is now around here and probably what Bernie Sanders is pushing for as well?

[oats]

Sanders is very much a fan of the Nordic countries' tax and social systems.

[Objective]

Sanders is very much a fan of the Nordic countries' tax and social systems.

Then I'd recommend others that ain't sure what they think of it to look into it a bit more and how it has positively affected us. Still serious issues here in Norway regarding retirement homes and shit though, we got shitload of cash but apparently they don't put enough into the budget so the elderly can have a decent end at life. Disgusting shit on that part but yeah, can't really complain about much else. It ain't flawless and there's always room for improvement but over all I'm satisfied with it.

[uh-oh]

I read an article criticizing the Scandinavian countries systems that bernie loves. Basically i think it used sweden as an example, talked about how its economy was built with capitolism in the early to mid 1900s and then shifted to the more socialist democracy. They started a crazy heavy tax on the rich and job creation plummeted because there was no incentive to get rich. I want to say it was something like a 100 percent tax over a certain amount earned.

So basically when he references these great socialist nations he doesnt want to acknowledge the capitolist system built them.

Personally i wouldnt mind if we had free college and healthcare, the only problem i have with it is bernie has no idea how to make it happen. His talks of taxing the rich to pay for it dont even cover like 10 percent of the cost it would take. Im not sure how the "single payer" healthcare thing works either

But to switch gears a little bit, lets say its rigged and a republican has to win

Do you guys prefer ted cruz to trump?

[oats]

uh-oh that sounds like complete horseshit tbh. taxes have very little effect on job creation (per history), and I can't imagine there was ever an 100% tax rate on anyone in modern history; it would be a retarded policy that, in all fairness, would certainly kill any kind of incentive. sounds like whoever wrote that invests too much in the antiquated, thoroughly debunked Laffer Curve.

progressive taxation (richer people pay more in taxes as a percentage) has been a demonstrably positive force in society since it was introduced. often, those high tax rates of 70-90% - in America or elsewhere - are applied after a certain amount. Meaning, as an example, you get taxed say 45% on your first 5 million dollars in annual income, and then after that it goes up.

also, good question. both Cruz and Trump strike me as pretty repulsive. I'd rather Rubio, Kasich or Paul from the GOP side.


Objective I admire a lot of Norwegian and Finnish social policies, especially the social safety nets and focus on education, but one of the reasonable criticisms of those policies is that America is a much bigger, more complicated place to try and implement them. Geographically, demographically, culturally etc, it's just a whole different beast than small, mostly homogenous countries. I could expound upon why I support Bernie even though I don't think any of his big propositions will work and/or get any political traction, but...yeah.

[Objective]

Oats: Yeah, I think the cultural differences and the way it works now is the biggest issue. Implementing such a system at once would mean a drastic lifestyle change for a lot of people. A change that would mean a lot would have to relocate and maybe live somewhere else and get people pissed off due to impatience to see the good impact it'll have in the long run. It would take some time before it's incorporated in a way that works with different modifications to cater to the US way of living and issues we don't face over here, and 4 years is far from enough to undergo such a development and it would probably not get another 8 years to make it happen due to the fact of those who are negatively affected by it and all of those that don't see the fruits of it immediately will vote for someone else next term as it'll probably take some time before it works as intended.

I believe the best would be to start off in smaller experimental cities and expand from there, from smaller cities to surrounding bigger ones and eventually entire states over the course of a decade or two preferably since the transition could need some time to go as smooth as possible with populations like that. Impossible situation that'll probably never happen but I'm allowed to dream, right?

[uh-oh]

Oats i cant link on my phone for some reason. Its a nypost article

You can google bernie sanders scandinavia and it should pop up.
In Sweden, the effective marginal tax rate topped 100 percent in some circumstances. There is a reason that IKEA founder Ingvar Kamprad fled the country in 1973. Sweden instituted a scheme to confiscate corporate profits and hand them over to labor unions. The idea was, in the words of a Swedish economist, to have “a market economy without individualist capitalists and entrepreneurs.”

It basically talks about how sweden prospered from low tax rates and then in the 70s they went full bernie and fucked everything up.

[Objective]

Even though it fucked shit up it doesn't mean it wasn't a step in the right direction either though.

[Destroyer]

Mike wrecka, I make like 40k a year so fuck you

[Destroyer]

also, if the opinion of a 40 something-year-old pothead is that you are an idiot, you should probably worry about that.

[Destroyer]

don't think the irony escapes me of you being a Trump supporter and also completely disregarding any opinion I should have…

[boof]

http://www.facebook.com/OccupyDemocrats/videos/979437065482681/

[Mike Wrecka]

A hip hop message board luckily is not a fair representation of the voting public. Of course it's full of liberals and socialists.

Trump trounces Hillary in every poll I've ever seen. So ummm yeah u guys losing. Sorry brahs

[Objective]

Trump trounces Hillary in every poll I've ever seen. So ummm yeah u guys losing. Sorry brahs

There's no winner here...

[Inno]

this is what happens when u tell Puerto Ricans they are American

[Destroyer]

if trump wins, it will simply mean there are far more idiots who vote than intelligent people

[Witty]

Trump won't win.

[Certain]

Trump trounces Hillary in every poll I've ever seen. So ummm yeah u guys losing. Sorry brahs

So you only watch Fox News then.

Here are actual complete results of major polls. (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_clinton-5491.html)

[Witty]

I am led to believe the latino vote may be enough to see Trump lose as they are the largest voting minority in the USA and growing by the day?

[Saint]

trump, I dont care for em all but bernie would create more financial problems than solution to inequality... its not a good idea to tax during a recession.

Clinton, not sure... too flip floppy, unethical and statist.

[uh-oh]

if trump wins, it will simply mean there are far more idiots who vote than intelligent people

Not necessarily.

Gore won the popular vote if i remember right. That sneaky electoral college THO

Id love to see trump win honestly. This thread has swayed me. The foreigners dislike him which endears him to me, as well as the fact he is the clear underdog on here. I gotta pull for the underdog bros

Im pretty disillusioned with thinking the president can do anything honestly. Obama promised the world and delivered a pizza

Nothing will change except for the person who speaks after tragedies

Murica 2016

[Witty]

trump, I dont care for em all but bernie would create more financial problems than solution to inequality... its not a good idea to tax during a recession.

Clinton, not sure... too flip floppy, unethical and statist.

I'm pretty sure America isn't in a recession.

That ended in 2009.

[Strikta]

It had major residual effects after 09 tho... it took until about 13 before we started to truly stabilize.

Hell we just got decent gas prices back last year.

[uh-oh]

Hey this might be a dumb question, but why do campaigns cost so much?

Like where is the money spent? Renting venues to speak?

[Sharp]

uh-oh for real bro there's plenty about a Hilary campaign/presidency I take issues with but I rarely ever hear them voiced outside of a democratic debate (which no one should watch) and I see what you're saying up until Trump being a viable presidential candidate. You could argue against Hilary for sure but compared to Trump she's definitely... Competent

And as far as your bracket thing with 100% rate might be something like what jfk did. It was like a 95% rate after a certain amount of business earnings but the point was to get them to reinvest back onto their company. But it was something like the top .0001%

Maybe

But I have no idea how Scandinavian countries do it

[uh-oh]

Word. Just to be clear i dont think any of them are viable. Maybe its just im grown now and paying attention but i feel like no one is qualified or close to competent. Its too big of a job. They all seem like buffoons to me.

If i was a voter i would vote trump over hilary because im honestly mysoginist and dont believe in women leading anything. To the point i would risk letting a narcissistic doofus in instead. Plus the like 9 scandals doesnt help her case. And i prefer trump to sanders strictly because any economic type shit trump does wont effect me personally, negatively. Where as bernie will. Its that simple really.

Carson is too retarded on a personal level. Cruz disgusts me as a slimy weirdo human. So its trump as the least worst to me personally.

I know little of what rubio or other republicans are about, they seem like they jave no shot. As far as dems I liked jim webb strictly cuz he had military experience and was the only one to my knowledge but then he freaked everyone out when he talked about killing enemies in vietnam. Dems too soft for that talk.

But yea its all completely fucked. Just know me preferring trump isnt from a standpoint of him being better than anyone. Theyre all shit. Give it to the loudest shit and maybe people will realize its an actual shitshow?

The last candidate i liked was ron paul. Its weird to me that people have jjmped from him, a conservative states rights less government type dude to bernie more government sandera tho

[~RustyGunZ~]

Not gonna read 7 pages of netcees very intellectual political discussion but Bernie sanders would ruin this country just as bad as the other two if not worse

He's a fairy tale hero

[Split Eight]

I feel like Republicans are constantly critiquing Democrats for scandals or policy gaffs, on account of the fact that their stance on nearly every political issue resonates very little with the majority of the public.

Like, I don't want a highly competent president if he's of your party because then he'll be really good at propagating inequality and burning bridges to social programs past


If there was a Republican whose platform was "If you elect me you don't have to constantly hear conservatives bitching, and I won't do much of anything of significance because I'm a deer in the headlights" he would get my vote

[Mike Wrecka]

Greatest. Thing. Ever


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0o1TXMAGtNE

[Chill Phil]

there might not actually be a 2016 election

[~RustyGunZ~]

I feel like Republicans are constantly critiquing Democrats for scandals or policy gaffs, on account of the fact that their stance on nearly every political issue resonates very little with the majority of the public.

Like, I don't want a highly competent president if he's of your party because then he'll be really good at propagating inequality and burning bridges to social programs past


If there was a Republican whose platform was "If you elect me you don't have to constantly hear conservatives bitching, and I won't do much of anything of significance because I'm a deer in the headlights" he would get my vote

Jeb bush 2016

[Eŋg]

Greatest. Thing. Ever


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0o1TXMAGtNE

if kim jong-il's corpse was reanimated, lobotomized and christened american to run for president this year.

land of the (brain-)free, home of the crazed.

[uh-oh]

Brainfree

[Objective]

Greatest. Thing. Ever


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0o1TXMAGtNE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmW0UC4tt9g

Also, how can you inspire freedom to the world when Trump plan to refuse to give it to those that should have it by default in your country at the same time? And no, I'm not talking about those with a serious criminal record... I see no issue denying them access to USA unless they've already gained citizenship and a passport (in this case they should be challenged in a court and sentenced in the US with a fair trial), freedom the way I see it is being able to do whatever you want by not jeopardizing the freedom of others in the process. You're free to do whatever you want within reason, once the freedom can be challenged I'm all for not granting people access regardless of where they're from. But the freedom isn't challenged by default just because you're from this or that country or following a certain religion with history in violence, because if it was Christianity along with a few other religions should be banned as well. The US also bomb cities and whatnot in the name of God and bless their soldiers. Hypocrisy going strong with this one, lol.

[uh-oh]

You make sense objective.

The only problem is while trump said muslims blatantly he is a dummy. He retracted and said "from that region" until they can figure out a proper vetting process. He is only denying america to syrian terrorists basically.

Also the freedom america offers is afforded to americans. The entire world isnt entitled to america.

I feel alot of liberals, and non americans have this one world view of things. No syrian should be allowed in by default. The problems of that nation shouldnt fall on my feet. Thats like the one place with barely any us intervention. Its been a shitshow before americans dabbled there, and the american people stopped obama from interfering and putting in ground troops.

So while you and others may feel america owes them something, americans dont.

[uh-oh]

Farrakhan aka the leader of the nation of islam agrees with him. Granted he is a black racist who probably views arabs only a little better than whites.

It just reminds me of most pc nonsense nowadays. The people who should be offended dont tend to care. Its liberal white people being outraged on their behalf.

Im waiting for trump to blow it.

If it comes down to trump and bernie its gonna be insane. Its just insane to me people think either of them will be able to do any of what they want. I just hope trjmp would win that since he at least has more realistic policies that affect my checks week to week.

Obama wanted free healthcare and that turned into me paying more money. Bernie wants free everything so that means even more of my money.

They need to repeal obama care and go back to how things were before. Im not sure what trumps policies are as far as thats concerned though.

Im basically just upping this thread because im bored and terrified that trump makes the most sense to my simpleton mind that hasnt been swayed yet.

[Diode]

ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME

i weep for this generation. they never had a chance.

[Mike Wrecka]

Also the freedom america offers is afforded to americans. The entire world isnt entitled to america.
.

Objective. That basically nullifies ur entire previous post


And I'm pretty sure Diode suffers from rich person guilt. He is literally a yuppy millionaire that lives off a golf course but is liberal because he feels bad for his cleaning lady Rosita making pennies while cleaning his toilet

[Diode]

Objective. That basically nullifies ur entire previous post


And I'm pretty sure Diode suffers from rich person guilt. He is literally a yuppy millionaire that lives off a golf course but is liberal because he feels bad for his cleaning lady Rosita making pennies while cleaning his toilet

i'm not rich nor am i a millionaire. i wish i had a cleaning lady because these fucking dishes won't wash themselves no matter how hard i try to convince them. i also don't live off a golf course.

i just have this thing called compassion and lack the myopic self-centered view of the faux-bootstrap crowd who fall into the category of either "fuck you, i got mine" or "fuck them, what about me?"

god forbid the greater picture come into focus.

[Diode]

also lol @ world isn't entitled to america.

time to tear down that statue.

also, your boy ronnie raygun sure seemed to feel different. read up on the containment policy and spreading democracy sometime, champ (though the latter precedes him back to the colonial era).

[uh-oh]

The problem with this generation diode, is people feeling entitled to everything. Im on my break so i cant address everything but there is a drastic difference between "spreading democracy" and letting people into america

Im not against immigration if you go through the proper channels. My entire lineage on my fathers side went through ellis island. They werent refugees fleeing a fucking warzone. They signed papers. They got ss numbers. They followed the laws of the land

Big difference between that and jumping the border.

[veritas]

I have much to say about this.

[uh-oh]

Also keep in mind america not letting people in due to there beliefs isnt new. Sup commies. Also race, sup chinamen.


But basically since like what post 1800 or some shit weve been super strict on who gets in. There is nothing wrong with vetting syrians, because there is nothing wrong with vetting anyone. You dont just get to be america. You arent owed that.

But im sure diode will be happy to take in syrians and let them sleep in his foyer while they attempt to get jobs speaking squiggly line language and groping good white women

Trump 2016

[veritas]

Diode is a liberal? Mwhahahahahahaha that is too perfect.

[veritas]

Now then:

If you owned a home and had a family, would you let 10 people who all had the flu into it>?

[Diode]

when you start with a fallacy, we know your attempt to debate (which, lol @ you trying to debate) is going nowhere.

next?

[veritas]

Diode:

If you owned a home and had a family, would you let 10 people who all had the flu into it>?

[Diode]

false equivalency. unless you see having brown skin and being murdered left and right by your government as a contagious virus, which you probably do, because you're a fucking moron.

next?

[Witty]

That is a truly awful argument.

First of all, nobody is letting them in to their homes unless they purposely choose to do so (which some people have in the UK and Ireland, dunno about America), and secondly, they aren't sick?

To answer your question to Diode, I would not hesitate to invite an unwell person who had nowhere else to go, in to my home, while taking the necessary precautions to make sure my family did not also become unwell, as would any decent person. My Mother once let an African immigrant live with us over Christmas as he had been evicted from his house, it's called empathy, it's called having a heart.

[Diode]

That is a truly awful argument.

First of all, nobody is letting them in to their homes unless they purposely choose to do so (which some people have in the UK and Ireland, dunno about America), and secondly, they aren't sick?

To answer your question to Diode, I would not hesitate to invite an unwell person who had nowhere else to go, in to my home, while taking the necessary precautions to make sure my family did not also become unwell, as would any decent person. My Mother once let an African immigrant live with us over Christmas as he had been evicted from his house, it's called empathy, it's called having a heart.

he's going to twist your reasonable proactive plan to prevent the spread of a virus in your home into you agreeing that we should do the same for all immigrants because, after all, immigrants are a virus.

(he's a fucking moron)

he will end this with "Fair?" and go beat off into an empty boston market bucket while imagining his slovenly wife covered in gravy

[Witty]

Lol

I dunno, I was just always taught it was right to help people in need. I consider it my duty to do so, not just immigrants, people within my community, ill people, anyone I can. That's what it means to be a good person, no? A lot of these immigrants are coming from truly awful places, they are fellow humans...I believe it is the duty of the better off to give a helping hand to those less fortunate. Some may say it's not their problem, I find that a despicable and wholly inhumane way of thinking. It shouldn't be a problem to help others.

[veritas]

false equivalency. unless you see having brown skin and being murdered left and right by your government as a contagious virus, which you probably do, because you're a fucking moron.

next?

wrong. Common sense. Step by step logical progression to prove contradictory hypocrisy.

Please answer honestly:

If there were 10 men outside your house and they said they had ebola and they needed a place to live for a little while would you let them stay. Assume also that Witty's good Samaritan "precaucitions" are not able to be enacted.

Yes or no?

[Diode]

it's not contradictory hypocrisy. you are presenting a false equivalency. do it again and i'll jail you.

how does that sound?

my patience for your fuckery is at an all time low.

[Witty]

wrong. Common sense. Step by step logical progression to prove contradictory hypocrisy.

Please answer honestly:

If there were 10 men outside your house and they said they had ebola and they needed a place to live for a little while would you let them stay. Assume also that Witty's good Samaritan "precaucitions" are not able to be enacted.

Yes or no?

I believe a hospital is where they should be, no?

Wtf can any of us do about ebola? lmao

If I were able to help them...then yes, if I were not, then that is out of my hands but it would not be due to lack of empathy.

[Witty]

Veritas...WWJD?

[veritas]

it's not contradictory hypocrisy. you are presenting a false equivalency. do it again and i'll jail you.

how does that sound?

my patience for your fuckery is at an all time low.


guess how this is going to play out? Answer the question:

I will progress it for you: Would you let 10 Syrian immigrants into your home with you and your wife?

[veritas]

Veritas...WWJD?

He would have no fellowship with Darkness...meaning he would not allow a potential member of ISIS, who have sworn to murder us and our families into his house.

If it wouldn't work in your house, how can it work for a whole country?



I should be jailed by now.

[Diode]

immigrants or refugees? specify.

FYI: INS specifies, dickbreath.

[veritas]

I believe a hospital is where they should be, no?

Wtf can any of us do about ebola? lmao

If I were able to help them...then yes, if I were not, then that is out of my hands but it would not be due to lack of empathy.

the point is that ebola would kill you. So you don't let it into your house. ISIS say that they want to kill us, so we don't let them into our house (country) until we get a sure fire way to detect them.

Gotta go with common sense here.

only to the liberal is common sense a fallacy lololol

[veritas]

immigrants or refugees? specify.

FYI: INS specifies, dickbreath.


How about Refugees? Would you let 10 refugees into your literal house with you and your wife?

[Diode]

How about Refugees? Would you let 10 refugees into your literal house with you and your wife?

yep.

[Witty]

I would.

They would have nowhere to sleep, because my house is tiny...but yeah. And I know my gf would too. I'd probably send a few to live with my mother, because she would take them in too, and she's majorly religious and as opposed to Islam as can be, she just understands that opposing an ideology should not translate to opposing innocent people with nowhere else to go. She is a true Christian, although she would not like the tag of being such, she relates more to Judaism other than the fact she believes Jesus is the Messiah. And btw the Syrians are not immigrants, they are refugees...major difference, look it up.

[veritas]

yep.

Would you let 15?

[Witty]

He would have no fellowship with Darkness...meaning he would not allow a potential member of ISIS, who have sworn to murder us and our families into his house.

If it wouldn't work in your house, how can it work for a whole country?



I should be jailed by now.

You are wrong. He absolutely would. He said turn nobody away...nobody. I would never let myself get to a point where I am so paranoid by something that statistically will probably never effect my life to make me not help the innocent. You are no follower of Jesus.

And also, don't even try saying there is no room in America...there is plenty, lots and lots and lots.

[veritas]

I would.

They would have nowhere to sleep, because my house is tiny...but yeah. And I know my gf would too. I'd probably send a few to live with my mother, because she would take them in too, and she's majorly religious and as opposed to Islam as can be, she just understands that opposing an ideology should not translate to opposing innocent people with nowhere else to go. She is a true Christian, although she would not like the tag of being such, she relates more to Judaism other than the fact she believes Jesus is the Messiah. And btw the Syrians are not immigrants, they are refugees...major difference, look it up.

I am all for charity. I am all for giving shelter. I think you are missing the point...let me try this then:

If a man was standing outside your house and said, let me in i may want to kill you, would you let him?

[Diode]

Would you let 15?

If my house could hold 15, sure.

[veritas]

You are wrong. He absolutely would. He said turn nobody away...nobody. I would never let myself get to a point where I am so paranoid by something that statistically will probably never effect my life to make me not help the innocent. You are no follower of Jesus.

And also, don't even try saying there is no room in America...there is plenty, lots and lots and lots.

Careful Fox, ye err in the scriptures.

[veritas]

If my house could hold 15, sure.


What is the exact limit of Syrian refugees you would be willing to house?

[Witty]

the point is that ebola would kill you. So you don't let it into your house. ISIS say that they want to kill us, so we don't let them into our house (country) until we get a sure fire way to detect them.

Gotta go with common sense here.

only to the liberal is common sense a fallacy lololol

You realize ISIS members likely to attack in the USA already live in the USA?

Statistically the chances of that hypothetical actually happening are minuscule to the point of irrelevancy.

[veritas]

what are the chances?

[Diode]

What is the exact limit of Syrian refugees you would be willing to house?

If I had limitless resources, it would be a limitless answer.

This is a stupid q&a though. I am not a nation state.

So you've got that going for you.

Which is nice.

[Witty]

The USA has taken in 784,395 refugees since 9/11...three have been terrorists.

[veritas]

If I had limitless resources, it would be a limitless answer.

This is a stupid q&a though. I am not a nation state.

So you've got that going for you.

Which is nice.

Great. So then would you take 10 ISIS members into your house?

[veritas]

The USA has taken in 784,395 refugees since 9/11...three have been terrorists.

what do you mean "have been terrorist"?

[Diode]

Great. So then would you take 10 ISIS members into your house?

I told you to stop the false equivalencies.

Final warning.

[veritas]

I told you to stop the false equivalencies.

Final warning.

Would you take 1 ISIS member into your house?

[Mike Wrecka]

time to tear down that statue

.

I want a t shirt that says that



Yes my great grandparents came through Ellis Island. BUT, and this is a big difference, the USA wasn't really that great of a place back then. German, Irish and Italian immigrants made this country what it is today. They assimilated and learned the language. They built this country from the ground up. Both my grandfathers fought in WW2, risked their lives for this country. They made this place great.

But instead of the descendants of those people reaping the benefits this great nation is being raped by immigrants that come here, don't learn the language, expect us to assimilate to them and take our money and send it back to their country. It's time to close the borders. We are past capacity. Americans are suffering.

[Witty]

Dead @ past capacity.

Holy shit.

[Mike Wrecka]

Walk through any part of NYC. Then tell me how much room we have here.

[Diode]

Walk through any part of NYC. Then tell me how much room we have here.

please tell me this is a joke.

this is a long con troll.

this has to be.

[Mike Wrecka]

You seem to be so out of touch with reality that I fear there is no reasoning with you.

Do you think it's possible that your success has shielded you from the atrocities I speak of? I'm sure all is peachy keen at your country club.

So many people in my family hAve been laid off from jobs and replaced by someone that doesn't speak English and will work for dirt cheap. They work for cheap because they live twenty to a house and just funnel money back to their family in Guatemala or whatever have you. They don't put down roots. They just steal jobs and then leave when they had their fill

[Witty]

Walk through any part of NYC. Then tell me how much room we have here.

NYC = America?

I see.

The REFUGEES (not illegal immigrants, not asylum seekers) are spread across the United States, a nation in which there is PLENTY of room.

Also, America takes hardly any refugees compared to others nations, including nations really not very well off. They are running from wars America helped start, they are running FROM ISIS, who btw would rather they didn't as it doesn't suit their vision of their caliphate being a refuge for Muslims.

[Witty]

You seem to be so out of touch with reality that I fear there is no reasoning with you.

Do you think it's possible that your success has shielded you from the atrocities I speak of? I'm sure all is peachy keen at your country club.

So many people in my family hAve been laid off from jobs and replaced by someone that doesn't speak English and will work for dirt cheap. They work for cheap because they live twenty to a house and just funnel money back to their family in Guatemala or whatever have you. They don't put down roots. They just steal jobs and then leave when they had their fill

That's capitalism, that's not the fault of the worker, that's the prerogative of the employer, that's who you should blame. The worker is just trying to survive. They also have the right to do whatever they want with their own money. They didn't 'steal' a thing, they were employed.

[Diode]

this is the classic misguided paradigm. myopic in nature. me, me, me.

blame the worker rather than the global hegemony that hires cheap labor and cheats our tax system.

it's hilariously delusional.

you've been gamed by your betters into loathing your peers and supporting their destructive ways.

congrats?

[Witty]

Immigrants don't pay taxes.
Immigrants pay taxes, in the form of income, property, sales, and taxes at the federal and state level. As far as income tax payments go, sources vary in their accounts, but a range of studies find that immigrants pay between $90 and $140 billion a year in federal, state, and local taxes. Undocumented immigrants pay income taxes as well, as evidenced by the Social Security Administration's "suspense file" (taxes that cannot be matched to workers' names and social security numbers), which grew by $20 billion between 1990 and 1998

In addition to the consumer spending of immigrant households, immigrants and their businesses contribute $162 billion in tax revenue to U.S. federal, state, and local governments. While it is true that immigrants remit billions of dollars a year to their home countries, this is one of the most targeted and effective forms of direct foreign investment.

The largest wave of immigration to the U.S. since the early 1900s coincided with our lowest national unemployment rate and fastest economic growth. Immigrant entrepreneurs create jobs for U.S. and foreign workers, and foreign-born students allow many U.S. graduate programs to keep their doors open. While there has been no comprehensive study done of immigrant-owned businesses, we have countless examples: in Silicon Valley, companies begun by Chinese and Indian immigrants generated more than $19.5 billion in sales and nearly 73,000 jobs in 2000. In addition to the consumer spending of immigrant households, immigrants and their businesses contribute $162 billion in tax revenue to U.S. federal, state, and local governments. While it is true that immigrants remit billions of dollars a year to their home countries, this is one of the most targeted and effective forms of direct foreign investment.
(Source: http://www.cato.org/research/articles/griswold-020218.html)


During the 1990s, half of all new workers were foreign-born, filling gaps left by native-born workers in both the high- and low-skill ends of the spectrum. Immigrants fill jobs in key sectors, start their own businesses, and contribute to a thriving economy. The net benefit of immigration to the U.S. is nearly $10 billion annually. As Alan Greenspan points out, 70% of immigrants arrive in prime working age. That means we haven't spent a penny on their education, yet they are transplanted into our workforce and will contribute $500 billion toward our social security system over the next 20 years.
(Source: Andrew Sum, Mykhaylo Trubskyy, Ishwar Khatiwada, et al., Immigrant Workers in the New England Labor Market: Implications for Workforce Development Policy, Center for Labor Market Studies, Northeastern University, Boston, Prepared for the New England Regional Office, the Employment and Training Administration, and the U.S. Department of Labor, Boston, Massachusetts, October 2002. http://www.nupr.neu.edu/11-02/immigration.PDF)

The percentage of the U.S. population that is foreign-born now stands at 11.5%; in the early 20th century it was approximately 15%. Similar to accusations about today's immigrants, those of 100 years ago initially often settled in mono-ethnic neighborhoods, spoke their native languages, and built up newspapers and businesses that catered to their fellow émigrés. They also experienced the same types of discrimination that today's immigrants face, and integrated within American culture at a similar rate. If we view history objectively, we remember that every new wave of immigrants has been met with suspicion and doubt and yet, ultimately, every past wave of immigrants has been vindicated and saluted.
(Source: Census Data: http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/censr-4.pdf)

No security expert since September 11th, 2001 has said that restrictive immigration measures would have prevented the terrorist attacks-instead, the key is effective use of good intelligence. Most of the 9/11 hijackers were here on legal visas. Since 9/11, the myriad of measures targeting immigrants in the name of national security have netted no terrorism prosecutions. In fact, several of these measures could have the opposite effect and actually make us less safe, as targeted communities of immigrants are afraid to come forward with information.
(Source: Associated Press/Dow Jones Newswires, "US Senate Subcommittee Hears Immigration Testimony", Oct. 17, 2001.)
(Source: Cato Institute: "Don't Blame Immigrants for Terrorism", Daniel Griswold, Assoc. Director of Cato Institute's Center for Trade Policy Studies http://www.cato.org/dailys/10-23-01.html)

Mike Wrecka Veritas the invincible

[Mike Wrecka]

NYC = America?

I see.

.

Oh so you're suggesting that when people arrive in the USA we force them to live in unpopulated areas? Great idea. North Dakota guess who's coming over for dinner. Pablo and his 20 cousins and also Isis. Enjoy!

[Witty]

Oh so you're suggesting that when people arrive in the USA we force them to live in unpopulated areas? Great idea. North Dakota guess who's coming over for dinner. Pablo and his 20 cousins and also Isis. Enjoy!

Lmao you really need to do some research in to your country's refugee policy before you talk about it dude. They also have the strictest vetting out of all countries.

[uh-oh]

I think the real question at hand is would diode with his never ending compassion allow 10 striktas to live in his house?

[uh-oh]

Also V you shouldve stated your terrible analogy along the lines of 10 people want to stay at your house and one might have ebola. It wouldve made more sense, yet still been irrelevant. But i like to see you fighting the good fight.

[Objective]

uh-oh and Mike Wrecka, I will get back to your points at a later notice. I read it some time back and started writing some but in order to be sure it was true I had to read up on some things and educate myself first. In the moment of doing so, I went to the toilet, went back to facebook, then youtube and blam closed the browser. Fuck... But I'll adress them later on.

In the meantime I advice you, and everyone else for that matter, to read this and reflect on the words before attacking (or even defending) the points it makes: http://www.thenation.com/article/after-i-lived-in-norway-america-felt-backward-heres-why/ After you've done that I'll be happy to debate further because your views are pretty foreign to me and I can learn more about the mentality behind those that oppose them.

From the article:
I was dumbfounded. Norway, Denmark, and Sweden practice variations of a system that works much better than ours. Yet even the Democratic presidential candidates, who say they love or want to learn from those countries, don’t seem know how they actually work.

Also:
So here’s the big difference: In Norway, capitalism serves the people. The government, elected by the people, sees to that. All eight of the parties that won parliamentary seats in the last national election—including the conservative Høyre party now leading the government—are committed to maintaining the welfare state. In the United States, however, neoliberal politics puts the foxes in charge of the henhouse, and capitalists have used the wealth generated by their enterprises (as well as financial and political manipulations) to capture the state and pluck the chickens.

[uh-oh]

I read it. I'll sleep on it and get at this tomorrow, one thing i will say is i disagree with everything to do with workers unions. Maybe they work differently over there, but over here you need to be cosigned in, pay exorbitant fees so the union leaders can throw shit parties, and they are all overpaid, do shit work at a snails pace and abuse the system to the point that a business or corporation would be stupid to hire union workers when people like me will come in and do a better job for a fraction of there salary.

One thing the US isnt in short supply of is its workforce. If ill do the job for a fraction of what a union will, best believe a Guatemalan will do it for a fraction of qhat i will take.

[uh-oh]

But uhoh, white people and americans feel they are too good to do the jobs illegal immigrants are willing to do. Huh. I wonder why. I work for a living and just had to pay money to the government during tax time. 40 hours a week. 52 weeks a year. Get like 5 holidays off, and 5 sick days paid.

My buddy meanwhile broke his hand got addicted to percocet, now sells them, pays no taxes, knocked his wife up with 3 kids, she works part time at a dollar store, and theyre getting 8 grand back in taxes when his wife didnt even make 8 grand probably, on top of the 600 a month in food stamps, rent assistance from the government etc. They live better than i do off mine, and every other working americans dollars

Eliminate that nonsense, dont give more social programs to help these losers. If they were starving maybe theyd go pick vegetables for minimum wage

America is different than those nordic countries. Our population is huge. The jobs are there, you just have to swallow your pride and work your way up honestly

I get clowned like im a poor savage. Im doing great. I got a shit job at a place i was above working at. I used that shit job to parlay into another shit job. I worked that shit job and got raises each year and now

[uh-oh]

I make more money than most of the people i went to school with and my job is paying for me to further my education in that field so i can make even more money.

No college. No diploma. Just real world american hard work.

My 24k a year or whatever sounds like shit but i have more than i need and live a happy life.

I agree in raising wages in places where cost of living is astronomical. But 12 an hour where im at is like 20 an hour in seattle or some place where 15 an hour makes sense as a minimum wage.

Im almost 5 dollars over the minimum wage. But im a poor uneducated toothless savage so what do i know.

[Certain]

Weren't you under $20,000 a year like two years ago, though? With no health insurance? Why the antipathy toward your roots?

[uh-oh]

Yes and i supported myself and my pops. No government assistance, i tried to get it but i made too much money according to them.

I still have no health insurance. I think its retarded to be forced to pay for it in a free society. Im not against free healthcare, i am against being forced to pay or being penalized

There is no why, really. Its just my views. Maybe its because i live amongst the peasants and see things for what it is. Im also in a small spreadout city, not an unrealistic mega metropolis. I understand that the system in those places is basically rigged if you are underpriveleged and the jobs arent there and all that i get it. I just see that as a problem that should fall on state and local governments. Not the federal government. The feds should be nothing but the military really. The government is to big.

To socialize everything makes it even bigger and more intrusive. We need to cut programs not add them

[Objective]

The Union you speak of sounds corrupt to say the least. That needs a serious clean up because it's supposed to protect the workers and all workers so they get the pay they're supposed to. But it's not a given you're given a job as well.

Everyone knows crime pays if you don't get caught.

If you struggle bad, you struggle bad and can't help it. I'm at a position in life where I can do fuck all, I'm worth shit atm. Just found out last therapist session it's anxiety and depression (knew that) coupled with PTSD (news to me, I didn't think it was that bad but apparently it is). I can't work due to energy levels being so low there's days where I wonder if I can even pick up the frying pan safely and make my own food without setting the house on fire or injure myself. It's that bad due to adrenalin being pumped constantly from the PTSD which goes out on my cortisol, and when that's drained not only am I more prone to getting the flu every other week (like I do) I'm also so drained of energy I can't function properly. And the serious sleep issues doesn't help my case either.

Thanks to help from the state I'm on a program to get me back to work with work practice in a firm that I helped build (we're just starting to get money into the firm now, me and 2 friends runs it and just today we got 4840$ on your firms bank account from clients). I don't get to see these money at all since I can't get paid while I'm on this program, I'm fine with that as it helps me get my life back on track while simultaneously pushing money back into the tax system and making a future for myself. When I'm back to full time work I'll probably make at least four times as much as I do now but unfortunately I mentally and physically can't. When I get back to work I don't mind paying a lot in taxes to give others the chance I have and it'll fast enough be put back into the pool once they get back to work too. Look upon it as investment because without it I'd probably be homeless and going back'n'forth to all kinds of other shit and generally being a dirtperson to society. Sure, people will abuse the system but most won't even though the media say differently. Most people want to feel like they matter and having a steady job and income not dependent on others is a huge factor to that. Those who try to abuse the system will still be put on work related programs etc. and pushed around to find something unless you got a doctors note that you suffer from this or that they won't let it slide. At least not around here, they'll put you on work related programs, school, education and group therapies etc. Prescription drugs is rarely the answer and you need a reform on that too, because the handbook of when to prescribe them is extremely different from the ones they use over here.

Also, I only got high school as well but know quite a bit when it comes to the line of work I'm in (web design, sales department and project management) with a developer with a masters degree in IT and programming on our team and another guy that dropped out of high school in the first week to start working on his own (he's the one that figured me and him should start a firm together since he saw the potential), and I got a knack for people and deals so I've managed to close a couple sales based on that too working with known brand name food chains to private business owners and hospitals. We currently got office spots in a place alongside product designers, architects, photographers and movie producers +++. It's pretty dope.

When I'm out of this shithole I'll make a shitload with my own firm thanks to the help and support of professionals and great colleagues and friends. An opportunity I wouldn't have had elsewhere or could even dream of. I'll agree that I've been really lucky as well though but even if my friends wouldn't be there, and the opportunity of being the co-owner of a firm with equal shares I'd still be working somewhere or going to school while figuring out wtf is wrong with me and work towards what is now my fall back plan of becoming a pre-school teacher. So I'd still have a chance at life.
Most likely, by the way things are going now and the quality of the product we deliver I won't be a poor fuck when I get back in work being my own boss and having therapists and consultants breathing down my neck (but thank God they do, I might have been dead if they didn't and I'm not exaggerating), working about 40-50 hours a week (we aim on 5 days a week, 8 hours a day but deadlines do exist). You know, just living the Nordic Scandinavian dream.

I have been working full time in the past at a daycare (loved it, no Tyson) but I can't keep a full time job right now because I'm severely fucked up in my head. And I'm lucky to have that opportunity due to where I'm from. Sure, your population is a lot higher than we have here but that also means you'll make a lot more in return taxes once it works as it should. It isn't done in a year or two but you'll see the fruits of it soon enough and get more people back in work. There will be more job positions available in the long run since working above a set amount isn't the standard anymore, and bosses and the like won't get so easily away with modern day slavery.

Sucks that you didn't get help for your father and got tough love from the state but it doesn't need to be that way. It SHOULDN'T be that way. Also 40 hours a week, 52 weeks of a year isn't okay. There should be a set minimum wage so that even when you choose the ''shit paid jobs'' it's still good enough to make a decent living when there's laws set in place so it can't go lower than a certain amount either so people will generally go for the most qualified people by default. Corruption may still be an issue but hopefully that'll have repercussions (like they do over here) that could be devastating enough for firms and workplaces to not take that risk since it could mean the end or a serious blow to their empire and end up costing more than they earned during the time it went unnoticed. It only seems unfair to do that now because the system you have are built upon unfair grounds and the rich gets richer while the poor get poorer principle.

I trule hope things change for the better for the US because from the outside I can't do nothing but feel deeply for the majority of you that go through year after year as robots in a system without being looked upon as human beings the majority of the time by the capitalist power structure that further demoralize and hurt your country from the inside.

Don't take me wrong, I love the US and can't wait to visit several states and cities in the future along with its great nature but you best believe I won't go there to get inspired from your way of doing things the next time I got a possible person in front of me that I may or may not hire.

Oh, and the guy I spoke about earlier in this thread with a chronic stomach disease? He's the one that wanted me in on this shit and joined forces with the programmer. Without his extremely expensive meds (in the states he wouldn't be able to afford them) this highly potential of a lucrative firm wouldn't even have been made. But just now we've spat back into the pool quite a bit of money from taxes and used freelancers/designers supplying work from what otherwise would have been impossible without the socialist way of doing things. So even from an economics capitalist standpoint it would foolish not to see the the benefits a system like this gives back for monetary reasons alone.

[Witty]

Objective I've recently been diagnosed with severe OCD, remember that the human mind can get past anything, keep going bro :)

[veritas]

I want to know, would anyone be willing to let 10 syrians in their house if 1 of them was an ISIS member? And you didn't know which one it was?

Please answer honestly.

[uh-oh]

Veritas, no one would.

Objective word man. I feel you 1000 percent. We just disagree on the base level of how we feel the system should be run.

Firstly i am with you on the mental illness angle. Ive been diagnosed with depression and social anxiety after i went to a crisis center when i was unemployed. I paid nothing. It was all covered by the state/feds or whoever. I talked to a therapist who put me on lexapro and there medical doctor person lady prescribed blood pressure meds since it helps with anxiety. That was after one 20 minute talk. I went back twice for 45 minute therapy session things like talking and each time they upped my dosage, there was like a month inbetween each session. The third time i went they upped the lexapro again and tried putting me on another since none of that was working. I left, threw the pills out and firmly believe depression is make believe. Not in the sense that its not a chemical imbalance but in the sense that you cant just fix it on your own. I spent many a night just crying by myself in a dark room moments away from blowing my brains out. When your life is shit youre supposed to feel like shit. Im not saying your situation is the same. Im just relaying mine. I ended up just telling myself and pretending i was happy. And magically i was. I faked happiness into getting a job and with that job ive done all the things they tell you not to do. Isolate. Avoid people. Cut off friends and now ive legitimately never been happier. Every situation is different. Its not like america wont help people. They tried helping me. Theyll help you get a job and provide housing and all that to get you on your feet.

And thats cool for people, that system didnt help me tho, i had to help myself. The prospect of being homeless forced me to get my shit together.

Its darwinism. You do what you gotta do. If you dont you die.

Thats great that your country is willing to support its people and get them on track but personally in my beliefs i dont think some people should be helped. It weakens the species.

This is where im a shitty human tho. And ill acknowledge it. I dont want to see people suffer. But i can also look at it objectively from a scientific Standpoint.

Thats me tho

I dont want to see people like diode punished for his success even if he is stupid enough to be for it. I want diode to make the money he makes and keep it. I want him to knock his wife up and spread his genes because hes a hardworking dirtball from new jersey that made good.

There is a misconception in this country that you cant live off the minimum wage. And in certain areas that is true. Thats why im for making the minimum wage higher on a local basis, not federally. The minimum wage in ohio is enough for 1 human to support themselves. It isnt a great living. But you can pay your bills and house yourself. Which is all you should be able to do, it gives the incentive to work harder to make more money. I worked minimum wage at subway and the money was shit so i took on more hours and got promotions and shit to get more money and then got a better job altogether.

You shouldnt be able to support a family on minimum wage but again this is where im a shitty human. I dont think you should even be allowed to procreate unless you can support the kid.

I just dont like government. It shouldnt be there to intervene like that. It should literally only exist as a means of diplomacy with other nations and to protect its citizens from other nations. Not themselves.

Thats just my views tho.

[Objective]

Fuck, I'm on mobile now but I'll get back to you. I actually agree with several of your points. A person shouldn't be spoonfed either, the state and my therapist do push me quite a bit as well, and that is needed. Also, different things work for different people. The notion that you can only be happy with lots of friends and isolation sucks isn't right for everyone, blood is not thicker than water either imo. But yeah, I'll get back to you on this, interesting points and you're not a dirt person just cus you want to do things differently.

[veritas]

Veritas, no one would.



So if it wouldn't work in your house, why would it work in a country?

[MC Fussy]

uh-oh if you dont like gov vote turnip.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61mxLkh9ZxL._SX522_.jpg

clinton a turncoat. talking about 'did i wipe the servers, do you mean with a cloth?' http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/video/hillary-clinton-jokes-wiping-email-server-cloth-33165989 cmon son.

http://i.imgur.com/ztmRd.jpg

her whole team should be in jail already she aint even qualified.

swear nixon was the last nigga to face consequences

[Diablo]

lmao think of the lulz if Trump is elected though


DO IT FOR THE LULZ, MURRICA

[Pharaohs Army]

-Enjoy the show while it lasts; if it comes down to Trump vs. Hillary, there is 0%...read, ZERO percent chance Trump wins.
It's a numbers game really.
No matter how fervent or fired up middleaged-nativist-white people get, it's not enough to win the presidency.
Even his appeal to independents or the Anti-Hillary vote will not be close to "enough".
Keep in mind I've been right in the past on these sorts of political predictions. Well, it's not that hard to be right, let me rather say that I was right "early on".

-Trump is funny and entertaining to me most of the time, despite the lies he spews. I'll tell you right now he doesn't believe deep down a lot of what he's saying. He's trying to win the republican nomination, and he's doing a good job of it.

-I hate the religion of Islam, but have I've got nothing against Muslims... Think about it.

-Banning a religious group from emigrating is not realistic or lawful. Not gonna happen; don't worry about it.

-Sure, vet Syrians. Better safe than sorry. But they are desperate. Suffering the worst of human tragedies. Help them.
I'd say there is a much bigger likelihood that the next radical islamist attack on US soil will come from lone wolfs/internet recruits who are already here/already citizens.

-The UK legislature's publicity stunt was pretty laughable. The best thing they could have done to make their point would have been a public statement, which said "We welcome Donald Trump to our country with open arms." Instead they lower themselves to the same tactics they wish to condemn?

-Only way to stop illegal immigration is to punish employers who knowingly hire them. Hefty fines; possible jail terms for repeated violators.

-I could never put my finger on why I dislike Hillary. But I finally figured it out-- besides the inauthentic vibes she gives off... it's more than that. Her public speaking is way too scripted and pandering... And the tone and inflections she uses make it sound like she's addressing her audience as little kids...little children to cheer her speechwriter's concise jab or inspiring phrase. Makes me vomit in my mouth a lil' to hear her speeches.

-People, especially right-wing voters, are so stupid. Benghazi benghazi!!! Talk radio and faux news just continually repeat lies until they become pavlovian response for their sheep..

-Bernie Sanders policy suggestions?... not unrealistic from a funding perspective.. Fractions of a penny taxes for rampant speculation trading.. &forcing the largest tax-dodging corporations to take their money from tax havens and pay... But, yes, unrealistic from a Congress perspective. Don't see Dems winning the house due to gerrymandering and idiots who vote in right wing nuts...also the special interests/lobbyists who court both parties.

-It's almost a dream world we're living in, in this country. The Palin endorsement speech is pretty much a summation of what we've devolved into. And it's not all "our" fault. The public is looking for anything other than "the establishment", and celebrity certainly helps.

-Rubio is the smartest, most acute on policy, and most electable of the Repubes... but he doesn't even do his job in Congress. Absentee alot, even before he was campaigning.
Also, his policies would have us embroiled in more counterproductive wars in the middle east. "Zero daylight" with us and Isreal... lmao, he and Scott Walkers, well... most of their slogan.. Sad.
Oh, and if a girl got raped and impregnated by her Dad he would want her to carry the baby for 9 months.
He's got a better shot at winning the Rnomination than people think.. Cruz and Trump very popular but it's a long year... Trump has been invincible so far but his ego will get him into at least a little bit of trouble at some point before the general election

-Cruz is a weasel, a caricature, but he's good at what he does. 0% chance in the general election as well.

-If I lived in a state where it mattered, I'd probably vote for Sanders because I don't like Hillary and because he is voicing the problems of our fkd up system. But I'm in NY... Hillary. So my 1 vote is quite negligible. We'll see.

-Trump is so easily playing on (not just nativist sentiments), but fantasy sentiments of the good ol' days, when america was the shit and we did whatev we wanted, and before our Debt Economy and military industrial economy and paper/investment economy "caught up with us"...

-No matter who's running for president, a lot of people blame their problems on gays and brown people. A lot, but not enough to win nationwide elections.

-the president does not control the economy, stupid!, as Immortal Technique once said

-It is amazing to me that people do not understand the magnitude of the 07-08 WORLDWIDE financial collapse. I have no problems with Democrat claims that Obama made it "less bad" in the U.S.... I don't love the guy or all his policies, but I think that's true. Many people disagree with that; but if pressed I will provide actual data and facts for my claim, unlike them.

-The problem with the need for massive change and overhaul (money in politics, a calcified congress)...is that people are too busy trying to pay the bills and raise families. Too busy to stay afloat. They don't have time to organize or fight for these things.

-Any substantive policy discussions can be instantly ended by bringing up abortion, gays, or guns...

-Speaking of guns, that's a place where I align more with the right-wingers and Bernie over Hillary.
To think of suing a gun store for millions and ruining the owner's lives... because a dude used one of their guns in a massacre? Ludicrous.
There are already laws on the books. If they were negligent or gave the guy a gun when he shouldn't be allowed to have one-- then they will be sued/prosecuted..

-Certain factions of Liberals have pissed me off of late. It makes me see why some people get so frustrated with them... like.. guns, affirmative action, the ridiculous levels of PC, being offended, needing a certain quota of blacks to win fuckin movie awards or the sky is falling, nothing against gays but stop being flamboyant if you wanna be treated like everyone else..

-Why do we have so many "evangelicals" in this country?
They have big voter turnout; that is another problem in our country.
voting is a basic right though... we should be looking for more folks to vote instead of less.. Right, republicans?

-"Vote them ALLLL out.... then elect the craziest of the craziest Tea partiers,,, that'll help things... u know those rigid constitutionalists who have no ulterior social agendas. lol (sarc)

aight i'll shup now

[Dope girl]

Vote- Clinton

[Objective]

Witty: I will, I never give up although it seems tough at times. You keep going too. :)
uh-oh: Finally, some time but I think I actually managed to cover a lot with my previous reply as well. However: ''You shouldnt be able to support a family on minimum wage but again this is where im a shitty human. I dont think you should even be allowed to procreate unless you can support the kid.'' I... Agree. But two people on minimum wage should be able to do so with 37-40h/week, at least with 1 kid. If two people want to make it work with 1 of them being a stay at home mom/dad then you're in tough luck and it's time for the other to get a job as well. This means that things need to be set in place so daycares isn't crippling anyone's financial situation too much, flu shots and other obligatory vaccines taken in school should be free to everyone (don't know if they are in the states, but they are over here and fuck the anti-vaxxers). I do however agree with minimum wages should be locally or by state like you said, it makes the most sense with how the US works.

What I do not agree with is your statement of the state not intervening with how citizens deal with their lives. Why? Because I think it's crippling to a country to not make sure the citizens are having fulfilling lives as over time it'll go out on the economy and/or have negative effects on crime rates and so forth with people taking the ''easy route'' or easier fall into addiction since nothing else works anyways and they may not get the bump they need to get back to work to make money and pay enough taxes that can help out the countryin several meaningful ways when used properly. Free healthcare to a certain extent should be a no-brainer, and any expenses should be based on a persons income and how much they can actually pay. It shouldn't be unfair either to rich people so a decline in costs overall should be set in place, it needs to be balanced in some way as well. But only to a certain extent of course, people shouldn't feel like it's worth to do nothing and I believe there needs to be certain grounds that needs to be met in order to receive welfare like actively looking for a job, help with how to conduct a interview and write a meaningful CV or attending courses/studying to up their qualifications so they can get a job if they lack qualifications to meet those demands. Someone dealing with depression and/or not finding any reasons to live will not do well with a job at McDonalds or Home Depot if their passion lies within IT if nothing is set place to help them get out of that bump and get a job they're okay with. But there should be certain reasons set in place for that to happen.

I also don't like how a shitload of people get in serious debt and battling it for decades for chasing education. It should be motivating to go for, not life altering if they can't get a job the moment they get out of there.
In Norway you can get scholar ships or loans and start paying off your debt once you get a job. Usually the state help with 50% of the cost or 100% depending on what you're going for and at which school given that you don't fail. If you fail the promise of 100% coverage will be brought down to 0%. Even when you fail you start paying once you're having a job and pay it down with a percentage based on how much you earn. If your debt (no matter where it stems from) is so huge you can't even pay a small portion you can gather the parties along with an impartial financial advisor from the state involved and make a deal to pay down as much as you can within 5 years based on a percentage of how much you get from working, and when those 5 years have passed it's cleared so you can start from scratch again and have a future free of debt. If one of the parties doesn't want that, tough luck as the financial advisor will then focus on those willing to through such a deal, focus on them, leave the other one in the dark as it piles up and the debt will be cleared and removed from all systems anyways. Most people are willing to make a deal so they can get at least part of what they initially owe. Often people need to sell their house (if it makes sense and renting somewhere is cheaper), car (and exchange it with a cheaper one if it's needed to get to/from work and public transportation can't get them to where they work) and other items in order to help paying down that debt, the main focus is to get rid of it all. Don't know if that's how it works in the US but it makes sense to me.

I think Bernie Sanders is a great candidate because the most ludicrous things he want to get through with is probably something that'll never happen, while the things that'll help to balance things a bit more and turn things into the right direction will probably happen.

Either way, Hillary over Trump all day, every day. That guys is hands down dangerous and will inevitably ruin important ties you have now.

[MC Fussy]

lmao think of the lulz if Trump is elected though


DO IT FOR THE LULZ, MURRICA

hilary vs trump is destiny. bernie is a dream/joke.

C.A.M.P.A.I.G.N. vote trump for the lulz. imma get stickers made

http://i.imgur.com/h6JHfBr.jpg

(but for real vote for palin)

[YDK]

Vote r!can

[MC Fussy]

make puerto rico a state. rock the boat. rock the vote.
statehood for american samoa.
whatever.

[Objective]

Trump supporters, y'all agree with this shit?

http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-gop-primary-live-updates-and-results/2016/03/donald-trump-geneva-conventions-221394

Just wondering. Thought this thread needed a revival after this.

[Blanco Bishop]

We fucked either way...

One tells u he would tear shit up

The other portrays democratic values but is responsible for massive amounts of deaths that have benefited her n her cronies pockets.

[PancakeBrah]

Trump is a candidate for extremely stupid and extremely pseud people. Any change, or disruption, you think he represents is ridiculous. He's a hack opportunist. Hillary is a shit but at least she knows what the fuck nukes are meant for. Trump's outward persona is blustery ignorance for a very specific, drilled in audience. Dumb people think he actually could make them rich. Pseud people think he's chaos, an atom bomb perfectly formed that will make all those "crooked politicians' realize the "people" won't stand for "this shit" any longer(!!!(HAHA!)). By himself, in a room alone, he's a fucking little person with insecurities that dominate any other thought. He's a poor businessman running on the momentum of his reputation as business man. He's a man hopelessly trying to understand anything about politics running as an outsider. He's a man who's shocked he won the primary who carries a constituent that loves him only because he's shocked by nothing. He's a fucking morning radio shock jock, given a bigger platform. He's already planted the seeds for the excuses of his loss, he doesn't even want this. And if he somehow got the presidency he would either do ABSOLUTELY NONE OF THE THINGS his base thinks he will do (while talking dope ass, nothing ass State of the Unions with a team of hairsprayers working active team, on screen) or he'll nuke some fuck ass country like Trinidad and Tobago because their 3rd highest ranking official subtweeted him. What's hilarious is that if the Republicans had just figured out a way to get a normal fucking human being with political knowledge into the primary, and she/he'd won, they would have won by a fuckton LANDSLIDE against Hillary.

Trump forever faggot. I hope his loss fuels his ridiculous insecurities to the point he joins this site and starts writing fucking Open Mics.

[I <3 DICK PT.2]

Lol I'm starting to like you Dancake

[uh-oh]

not a trump "supporter" yet i agree whole heartedly. the problem is we aren't at WAR. these are weirdo conflicts where we invade sovereign nations to fight groups within that nation, and not the nation itself.

i'm all for civilians not being rounded up and slaughtered, or just killed recklessly and non descript like. these conflicts become ridiculous because of that fact. we aren't at war with afghanistan, iraq, syria, libya, yemen pakistan you name it. we're at war with "radicals" within these nations

if we weren't restricted by all this nonsense, i don't think we would be there. it would lead to us actually leaving

i dont know though, i've talked with veterans and the shit is fucked. dude i worked with for a little whiles base was attacked in afghanistan. giant truck pulled up and blew the place up at the gates, his bunk/barracks or what have you was near enough that the concussive force fucked him. other than being blinky and twitchy he seemed well enough, but he was talking about when they went out ranging and shit they would see hostiles up in the hills running from them, they would be carrying munitions, clear as day, but not engaging them, so they were ordered to follow and basically wait until they shot at them, when they came up on top of a hill there was a hut and a little farming area and there was like 7, 20 year old afghan men, no women or children anywhere, all pretending to be hoe-ing the ground, they were compliant and after a search of the hut they found ak's and all that shit, to which they pleaded ignorance to, and said someone put it there. they took the weapons, but had to leave them be.

they watched them run away with weapons were ordered to follow, found the weapons and had to leave them be. thats nonsense. everything has to be relayed through radio with superiors before doing anything, with the exception of them being shot at. how retarded is that. those dudes lived to fight another day, and probably killed americans/english/canadians whoever else is out there. couldve been murked running away up a hill.

thats why if they didnt have to come under the scrutiny for every round they fire progress could actually be made.

the difference is they are at WAR with INVADERS. we are at "war" with an ideology. its stupid.

i'm in favor of getting out, and when we do declare war, its actual war. there is a reason we firebombed japan. there is a reason we nuked japan. we were at war with the nation, and what is a nation if it isn't the people? war is killing people. if we become so advanced that our militaries are literal robots, do you think we would send our robots to kill their robots?

ITS FUCKING WAR

[PancakeBrah]

Good article for those with the attention span for it

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2016/07/how-american-politics-went-insane/485570/

[Blanco Bishop]

Good article for those with the attention span for it

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2016/07/how-american-politics-went-insane/485570/



Ive read it before.

But how do we go back?

[Adonis]

Voting Gary Johnson

Close thread

[PancakeBrah]

Yo i need some netcees overlord to give me a stat on how often an Adonis post is the worst post in a thread.

This motherfucker is hitting like .780 in that category.

[uh-oh]

Trump supporters, y'all agree with this shit?

http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-gop-primary-live-updates-and-results/2016/03/donald-trump-geneva-conventions-221394

Just wondering. Thought this thread needed a revival after this.

reading again they seem to be only touching on the torture aspects, not as much rules of engagement and shit. im not big on torture for the simple fact you can torture a person to say anything. for every bit of factual intel you get you're gonna get a load of malarkey. i'm a dummy citizen though so i don't really know how effective it could be.

when it comes to rules of engagement though just look throughout history for countless examples where being the "better" nation fails. from the "chivalry" times with knights being shredded by the "dishonorable" longbowmen, to the mongols and huns, and even before that to bc times, with roman infantry being slaughtered by parthians. going in expecting a battle where the lines meet, but they parthians just ride up to the heavy infantry of romans, pepper them with arrows and ride away firing more never engaging.

but again its stupid the "wars" we are in. we cant just ride in burn crops and houses. we can't indiscriminately kill a town etc.

reading caesars conquest of gaul for the bazillionth time, and just think about the fact that if you harbored militants he would burn your fields and town, and take all the people they didnt slaughter as slaves. in 2016 it seems terrible. but it was war. you have to deprive the enemy of its will to fight. we do the opposite, and give them more reasons to fight by trying to be tactical and just end up being inefficient.

there is no winning this war.

even look to vietnam, where america was BODYING vietcong. the body count was ridiculously in favor of america, but the images and horrors of war were broadcast, stories of innocent villages being burned got to the hippies and liberals, and when a people doesn't support a war the war is lost. we aren't so different from our ancient ancestors as everyone would like to think. genetically we are exactly the same. our social norms have changed sure, but if the softhearted in rome, the great britain empire, the spanish, french you name the conquerer if there people were shown the horrors of war the war machine would have lost all support.

thats why we are failing in all these conflicts. the people don't support them anymore.

george bush had support initially, we went to war with iraq itself to depose sadaam, and did so. there was bombing of cities. sieges of cities. everything that actually resembled war. now we use tactical strikes that resemble nothing precedented in history. its really a campaign of terror where if a drone strike doesn't kill you like a lightning bolt from zeus himself, a tactical squad will kick the door down to kill and capture a name off a list that only gets longer

ITS NONSENSE AT BEST MATE.

[Blanco Bishop]

reading again they seem to be only touching on the torture aspects, not as much rules of engagement and shit. im not big on torture for the simple fact you can torture a person to say anything. for every bit of factual intel you get you're gonna get a load of malarkey. i'm a dummy citizen though so i don't really know how effective it could be.

when it comes to rules of engagement though just look throughout history for countless examples where being the "better" nation fails. from the "chivalry" times with knights being shredded by the "dishonorable" longbowmen, to the mongols and huns, and even before that to bc times, with roman infantry being slaughtered by parthians. going in expecting a battle where the lines meet, but they parthians just ride up to the heavy infantry of romans, pepper them with arrows and ride away firing more never engaging.

but again its stupid the "wars" we are in. we cant just ride in burn crops and houses. we can't indiscriminately kill a town etc.

reading caesars conquest of gaul for the bazillionth time, and just think about the fact that if you harbored militants he would burn your fields and town, and take all the people they didnt slaughter as slaves. in 2016 it seems terrible. but it was war. you have to deprive the enemy of its will to fight. we do the opposite, and give them more reasons to fight by trying to be tactical and just end up being inefficient.

there is no winning this war.

even look to vietnam, where america was BODYING vietcong. the body count was ridiculously in favor of america, but the images and horrors of war were broadcast, stories of innocent villages being burned got to the hippies and liberals, and when a people doesn't support a war the war is lost. we aren't so different from our ancient ancestors as everyone would like to think. genetically we are exactly the same. our social norms have changed sure, but if the softhearted in rome, the great britain empire, the spanish, french you name the conquerer if there people were shown the horrors of war the war machine would have lost all support.

thats why we are failing in all these conflicts. the people don't support them anymore.

george bush had support initially, we went to war with iraq itself to depose sadaam, and did so. there was bombing of cities. sieges of cities. everything that actually resembled war. now we use tactical strikes that resemble nothing precedented in history. its really a campaign of terror where if a drone strike doesn't kill you like a lightning bolt from zeus himself, a tactical squad will kick the door down to kill and capture a name off a list that only gets longer

ITS NONSENSE AT BEST MATE.




Ur not getting the point bro.

To these motherfuckers war is not a moral issue.
War is big business.
These neo cons don't give a fuck about ideology. All that is just a front.
Point blank. If we dont address this industrialized military complex, America will always "be at war."
They just keep renaming the enemy.
Communists, Taliban, al quada, ISIS, etc....

[Aero]

Trump is a candidate for extremely stupid and extremely pseud people. Any change, or disruption, you think he represents is ridiculous. He's a hack opportunist. Hillary is a shit but at least she knows what the fuck nukes are meant for. Trump's outward persona is blustery ignorance for a very specific, drilled in audience. Dumb people think he actually could make them rich. Pseud people think he's chaos, an atom bomb perfectly formed that will make all those "crooked politicians' realize the "people" won't stand for "this shit" any longer(!!!(HAHA!)). By himself, in a room alone, he's a fucking little person with insecurities that dominate any other thought. He's a poor businessman running on the momentum of his reputation as business man. He's a man hopelessly trying to understand anything about politics running as an outsider. He's a man who's shocked he won the primary who carries a constituent that loves him only because he's shocked by nothing. He's a fucking morning radio shock jock, given a bigger platform. He's already planted the seeds for the excuses of his loss, he doesn't even want this. And if he somehow got the presidency he would either do ABSOLUTELY NONE OF THE THINGS his base thinks he will do (while talking dope ass, nothing ass State of the Unions with a team of hairsprayers working active team, on screen) or he'll nuke some fuck ass country like Trinidad and Tobago because their 3rd highest ranking official subtweeted him. What's hilarious is that if the Republicans had just figured out a way to get a normal fucking human being with political knowledge into the primary, and she/he'd won, they would have won by a fuckton LANDSLIDE against Hillary.

Trump forever faggot. I hope his loss fuels his ridiculous insecurities to the point he joins this site and starts writing fucking Open Mics.

All facts.

[Adonis]

Yo i need some netcees overlord to give me a stat on how often an Adonis post is the worst post in a thread.

This motherfucker is hitting like .780 in that category.



Far superior to the law breaking Hilary and the retarded shock value of trump.

Was elected as a Democrat in the highly Republican state of Texas multiple times, I'd say that should tell you enough. But, he's an actual candidate homie. He's a real person that has done wonderful things for the state of Texas of his full term. His beliefs are in line and identical to Bernie Sanders, so by you saying I know shit you're also saying Bernie would have been a bad choice. Him and Bernie take the same stances except for taxes, which Bernie was crazy and Johnson is slightly less crazy.

Before posting a simple post with no meaning aimed at comedic value understand what you're saying. Clearly you know nothing about him so go vote for the murderous woman or the insane bald guy. At some point, and i believe that point is right now, people need to take a stand and vote third party. This two party system is clearly broken and crooked as Bernie rightfully beat out Hilary in primaries but still lost.

Basically don't come at me with your jokes, you won't like it little man

[Certain]

Far superior to the law breaking Hilary and the retarded shock value of trump.

Was elected as a Democrat in the highly Republican state of Texas multiple times, I'd say that should tell you enough. But, he's an actual candidate homie. He's a real person that has done wonderful things for the state of Texas of his full term. His beliefs are in line and identical to Bernie Sanders, so by you saying I know shit you're also saying Bernie would have been a bad choice. Him and Bernie take the same stances except for taxes, which Bernie was crazy and Johnson is slightly less crazy.

Before posting a simple post with no meaning aimed at comedic value understand what you're saying. Clearly you know nothing about him so go vote for the murderous woman or the insane bald guy. At some point, and i believe that point is right now, people need to take a stand and vote third party. This two party system is clearly broken and crooked as Bernie rightfully beat out Hilary in primaries but still lost.

Basically don't come at me with your jokes, you won't like it little man

Jesus, man, Gary Johnson was the Republican governor of New Mexico. Maybe have some idea of whom you're voting for next time.

[Adonis]

Jesus, man, Gary Johnson was the Republican governor of New Mexico. Maybe have some idea of whom you're voting for next time.



My mistake, i miss read one article on some selective reading type shit. But to say I have no clue shows your boarding prowess as well. Sure that was a main point of mine, and wrong, but to pull that alone from the text as evidence over everything else is, well, the easy way to debate and while not dropping any knowledge and going with the usual comedic timing around these parts. No better then a troll certainly.

What happened? You go Google my post and select the one point you could argue and thought that makes you holier then I? Not happening

[Certain]

I didn't need to Google. I just read a profile on Gary Johnson a week ago. It's good, and it might make you like him more: http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/gary-johnson-the-third-party-candidate

Libertarianism is not at all like socialism, though. Bernie Sanders and Johnson agree on many social issues, but their ideas on domestic and international policy are massively divergent. And as easy as it is to vote based on black-and-white agendas like abortion rights, drug laws and gun control, those are not the most important issues that a president has to deal with.

Johnson and the Libertarians want to privatize all forms of health care and repeal a large chunk of social security. Sanders and the left-most side of the Democratic party want to massively increase those rights.

Libertarians want to dramatically reduce our efforts in organizations like NATO and the UN. Leftists are perhaps a bit divided on that issue but definitely recognize the value of those two organizations.

Libertarians want to create an environment where business owners are less inhibited. Leftists want to protect the employees of those owners, recognizing that most Americans are not business owners.

It's fine if you're Libertarian, but Johnson and Sanders are not running on even similar platforms.

[Witty]

Libertarianism makes sense up to a point...and then it just gets crazy.

[veritas]

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/BODIES.php

here is a list of over 50 people associated with the clintons who have mysteriously died or suicide.

f this world. The simple fact that she even has a chance and isnt in jail is proof that this world is evil.

[veritas]

wait let me ask..we can debate trumps baffonery or merits....but we can all agree no to hillary right? is anyone actually going to vote for hillary hear? please stand up and be taken into account?

[uh-oh]

libertarianism makes sense on all points witty. i just don't like gary johnson as a man. he's cringeworthy in his levels of corniness. but i agree with basically everything he stands for and if i was to vote it would be for him.

one of the main things no one talks about with all these social programs is the ineptitude of the government in handling anything. social security is already fucked and doomed to fail before the majority of us are able to collect. expanding upon it as well as instituting more "safety nets" for people make no sense, economically without drastically cutting pretty much everything else as well as taxing the ever loving fuck out of EVERYONE, not just the elite like all these dummies think. tax the 1 percent mannnnn stfu lol

meanwhile privatization works great. a business has accountability, the government doesn't. i agree that business should be regulated to a point to stop monopolies and just other heinous shit, which is my slight divergence from libertarianism. but on the whole im for privatizing basically everything.

[uh-oh]

wait let me ask..we can debate trumps baffonery or merits....but we can all agree no to hillary right? is anyone actually going to vote for hillary hear? please stand up and be taken into account?

trumps gonna nuke trinidad mannnnn!! trumps a failed businessmen mannnn! he only has like 4 billion he would have like 20 gazillion if he invested in a roth ira mannn!!! hilary is the only choice!!!!

[veritas]

Be serious, Jim.

[uh-oh]

Be serious, Jim.

i was showing the absolute idiocy of the opposing sides argument Jim. trump is easily the lesser of two evils, anyone who actually looks into it can see that. people are just so swayed by the media, and so indoctrined by the political correctness of prior candidates that they think trump is some unhinged lunatic, when in reality clinton is the homocidal sociopath who has only ever been about herself. not that trump isnt about himself, but you already know i don't need to explain it to you.

both are terrible choices but they are the choices. neither will bring about the end times. i see hillary as the worse option due to her track record in politics and life. i also lean conservative so i'm against most of what she's for

no ones minds will be changed, all these do is make us all feel worse about "our guy" when none of them are our guy. they are just the closest thing to it. and by closest i mean pretty far but oh well.

[Split Eight]

I would vote for Hillary. I think she's done a good job in her office, and will make a good president.

[PancakeBrah]

Uh oh still has a soft spot on his head.

[uh-oh]

Uh oh still has a soft spot on his head.

NUH UH

UNLESS YOU MEAN THE HEAD OF MY DICK WHEN I LOOK AT HILLARY

HEYO

[Witty]

No ideology works completely, all have good sides and bad sides, I think a liberal ideology has more good sides than the others. but I think there are good things about libertarianism and conservatism that shouldn't just be abandoned. A mixture of ideologies is the way to go.

[uh-oh]

No ideology works completely, all have good sides and bad sides, I think a liberal ideology has more good sides than the others. but I think there are good things about libertarianism and conservatism that shouldn't just be abandoned. A mixture of ideologies is the way to go.

word thats basically what libertarianism is. the good sides from both lol. economically conservative and socially liberal

[Witty]

They are liberal when it comes to personal rights...I wouldn't say they are liberal on social issues in general.

If they were I'd probably be a libertarian, because of their beliefs in personal freedoms, and the fact they aren't as economically naive as many liberals. And they aren't as batshit crazy as many conservatives...but like I said, it's actually their ideas on social issues like healthcare, the prison system, etc which turns me off.